Conservatism Is Dead — Is America Next?

ToogoodReports ^ | March 6, 2002 | Chuck Baldwin

[Starmaker]

A column written by Joseph Sobran entitled Defining Conservatism Downward accurately describes the state of conservatism today.

Sobran writes, "Once upon a time, conservatives stood for limited government, the rollback of the welfare state, strict construction of the Constitution, and traditional morality. Today they merely want their own people to run big government."

Sobran goes on to say, "They (conservatives) used to oppose needless military intervention abroad; today they equate militarism with patriotism. They used to demand that the U.S. Department of Education be abolished; today they want to expand it. They used to denounce Franklin Roosevelt; today they venerate him."

Again, Sobran writes, "Constitutional government? Conservatives have simply dropped the subject. They can live with the status quo, which is not conservatism's legacy but liberalism's. Yesterday's heresy has become today' s orthodoxy."

Sobran's concluding remarks include, "Former Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan has observed that we have 'defined deviancy downward' - that is, we have become so inured to behavior formerly recognized as deviant that we have tried to cope by lowering our standards. In the same way, conservatism has been 'defined downward.' The principles conservatives once upheld have been defeated politically, so conservatism has abandoned them, adopting instead the old liberal positions and calling them conservative."

Joe is one hundred percent right! His description of modern conservatism is painfully accurate. In a word, it is dead! I say again, conservatism is dead! In truth, there is no conservative movement left in this country. Furthermore, there is virtually no conservative representation in Washington, D.C., today.

I would even argue that F.D.R. would be right at home in today's Republican Party! There is virtually no discernible difference between the philosophies of the two major parties. Outside of a few very lonely congressmen, no one in the federal government has any desire or intention to return this country to constitutional governance.

What is worse is that rank-and-file "conservatives" (and even Christian "leaders") seem very enthusiastic to embrace big government socialism and unconstitutional leadership as long as their people (Republicans) are in charge. Blind loyalty to the Republican Party in general and to President Bush in particular has destroyed the conservative movement!

Some are following this duplicitous Pied Piper out of ignorance. They have been brainwashed by a half-Century of humanism and have never bothered to read the U.S. Constitution (or the Bible) for themselves. Others follow for the purpose of self-aggrandizement. They have a vested personal interest in sitting at the seat of power (even if that seat is at the back of the bus).

Whatever the motivation, today's conservatives have compromised the principles of conservatism and constitutional government to the point that those principles no longer exist. By being willing to forsake their conscience in order to win the presidency, they have buried both their conscience and constitutional principle.

It is imperative that true conservatives and constitutionalists quickly wake up to the reality that both major parties have betrayed them, that the fundamental principles of the Declaration, Constitution, and Bill of Rights are being obliterated without opposition! They must abandon loyalty to these parties! Only brave and independent people can preserve liberty. Are there a sufficient number of such people left in America? We shall see.

[Lumberjack]

There are scads of truth in this tract that you posted. That being the case, expect the cheerleaders and koolaid drinkers to apply maximum flame and name calling against you and the author of this piece, without once addressing or being able to refute the arguments presented here.

Thanks for having the cajones to post this. They need to read it, if for nothing but "tough love". :)

[A Vast RightWing Conspirator]

Blind loyalty to the Republican Party in general and to President Bush in particular has destroyed the conservative movement!

Not to mention that it generates oodles of boring-to-death threads on FR.

I just like to write 'oodles'.

[steve50]

Can't argue with it. The republicans of today are bigger control freaks than the dems of 40 years ago.

[Eagle Eye]

There will be critics who will attack Baldwin, as they have in the past. Baldwin's life DEFINES Conservatism. Principle's Conservatism. I know the guy. I do not agree with his views and approaches to everything, but I greatly admire and respect him and his family. I'll probably run into him at the local gun show this weekend.

Don't expect to see much of a line-by-line specific rebuttal. Do expect to see 'witty' one line hit-and-run criticisms and personal attacks.

[Lucky]

Sobran is right on.

[Khepry]

The problem with Ridge, Bush, Clinton, Reno etc. is that the "establishment" doesn't trust their own people. Everything from education to welfare, child safety to self defense must be controlled and legitamized only by the elites. To them democracy is a big mistake, because it doesn't grant them the perpetual right to rule. They fear the people's common sense most of all, because more and more people, regardless of political views or indoctrinations, are asking: Who are these sanctimonious fools who pretend to lead, but infact protect only themselves and their pretensions to power? Why should the sovereignty of we the people continue to carry the burdens of such parasites? Why elect or reward the rule of those whose foundation is laid with fear, fanaticisn, failure, freaks, fools, fraud and phoniness?

Does any American truly believe that George Bush or Al Gore or Bill Clinton or Bob Dole are the best people out of 280 million Americans to be our leaders? Of course not. Our political parties are nominating candidates remarkable only in their intellectual and moral mediocrity, combined but with an egotistical self importance that transcends rationality. We have allowed a political priesthood of sycophantic wannabees surround our leaders in caccoon of fantasy where in they actually believe they are the lords of the earth on which all must depend for their subsistence and salvation.

The Republic of the United States was such a quaint experience - to bad their aren't enough sons and daughters of liberty that price truth and freedom more than their security and entertainment.

[thepitts]

Sobran writes, "Once upon a time, conservatives stood for limited government, the rollback of the welfare state, strict construction of the Constitution, and traditional morality. Today they merely want their own people to run big government." Sobran goes on to say, "They (conservatives) used to oppose needless military intervention abroad; today they equate militarism with patriotism. They used to demand that the U.S. Department of Education be abolished; today they want to expand it. They used to denounce Franklin Roosevelt; today they venerate him." Again, Sobran writes, "Constitutional government? Conservatives have simply dropped the subject. They can live with the status quo, which is not conservatism's legacy but liberalism's. Yesterday's heresy has become today' s orthodoxy."

This pretty much nailed it.

[Cincinatus]

Whatever the motivation, today's conservatives have compromised the principles of conservatism and constitutional government to the point that those principles no longer exist. By being willing to forsake their conscience in order to win the presidency, they have buried both their conscience and constitutional principle.

Breathless blither.

"Conservatism" has always had two strains of thought; libertarian and federalist (or Hamiltonianism). The libertarian branch of conservatism is actually a fairly recent innovation -- Barry Goldwater articulated the "less government is better" mantra during his 1964 presidential campaign (and subsequently). Goldwater "borrowed" the "less government" concept from Jeffersonian Republicanism, even though he was perfectly well aware that it was an antiquated concept in a modern, industrial state; he needed the concept to fight New Deal government socialism. But Goldwater never made a fetish of his libertarianism; he was perfectly capable of favoring "Big Government", heavy-handed action when he thought national strategic interests were at stake, such as fighting world communism.

Hamiltonian federalism is the other principal strain of "conservatism." It's fundamental premise is that people are basically rotten (as opposed to the Jeffersonian idealistic view that people are basically good) and proposes to rein in the tendencies of the mob through a federal, republican system of government. They recognize that without order, there is no liberty.

This piece is just more paleo-con/libertarian whining about how "conservatism" is dead. These clowns wouldn't recognize a conservative ideal if they tripped over it. And they most certainly would be completely incapable of governing anything. Clearly they are incapable of concealing their own ignorance.

[fporretto]

Sobran is right. Baldwin is right. And I get to say that I've been right, too.

Conservatism, as such, was never a political position but rather a predilection for stability, a distrust of rapid change. This is not in itself an unworthy thing, but it can be hijacked by the statist quo exactly as advertised in Baldwin's piece. Thomas Sowell has noted that all a liberal usually has to do to get a conservative on his side regarding some government program is to argue that the program is "here to stay."

More than ever, we need to return to principled politics: a politics that addresses fundamentals of right and wrong, that strains to understand why some things are right and others are wrong, and that absolutely forswears doing wrong for any "pragmatic" benefit. It would clear the fog from many minds. It would clarify the many arguments over what governments should do and must not do, since government is only an instrument of organized coercion. It might even lead the politically disaffected back into engagement with their country's government.

To quote Herbert Spencer:

I asked one of the members of Parliament whether a majority of the House could legitimize murder. He said, No. I asked him if it could sanctify robbery. He thought not. But I could not make him see that, if these things be always wrong, and not to be made right by the decisions of statesmen, then similarly all things must be always right or always wrong, apart from the authority of the law; and if the right and wrong of the law is not in harmony with this intrinsic right and wrong, the law itself is criminal. (From The Proper Sphere Of Government)

Lovely thoughts.

Freedom, Wealth, and Peace,
Francis W. Porretto
Visit The Palace Of Reason: http://palaceofreason.com

[Eagle Eye]

These clowns wouldn't recognize a conservative ideal if they tripped over it.

You clearly do not know the author. I do. Name a Conservative principle (I'll skip the 'oxymoron' jokes for the moment) and he probably embodies it.

I think you are upset because he pretty much nailed your party and it is easier to attack the messanger than the message.

[junta]

Perhaps you could articulate a conservative ideal for us.

[Cincinatus]

I know the author, and what he believes, quite well. My contention is that he doesn't understand that "conservatism" has different strains and different philosophies. He is a paleocon. That entails certain attiudes and beliefs. But it is not now, nor has it ever been, the totality of "conservatism."

[woofie]

It is imperative that true conservatives and constitutionalists quickly wake up to the reality that both major parties have betrayed them, that the fundamental principles of the Declaration, Constitution, and Bill of Rights are being obliterated without opposition! They must abandon loyalty to these parties! Only brave and independent people can preserve liberty. Are there a sufficient number of such people left in America? We shall see.

So once you wake up, whats next? jump off a cliff? Doom Doom...we are all doomed ...it sure sells to the "we are doomed" crowd

[Cincinatus]

Here's a book full of them.

[Eagle Eye]

Bladwin lives more in the black and white than in the shades-of-grey world. At what pont does one disagree with Baldwin and still stay a Conservative? What strains of Conservatism are there that differ significantly with CB and can still be Conservative?

I contend that the current administrations does NOT qualify as Conservative, exept in the eyes of the hard-corps leftists.

[Blood of Tyrants]

I'm glad he is where I was 4 or 5 years ago. Socialist party A and Socialist party B.

[Blood of Tyrants]

P.S. I hope the people will start to see this also and abandon both parties.

[Liberal Classic]

Goldwater "borrowed" the "less government" concept from Jeffersonian Republicanism, even though he was perfectly well aware that it was an antiquated concept in a modern, industrial state...

I couldn't disagree more.

[Doctor Stochastic]

"...Today they merely want their own people to run big government."

They have always been that way.