Priest Fears Gays in Ranks Pose Threat to Church

Boston Herald ^ | 3/6/02 | Joe Fitzgerald

[sinkspur]

I gave you all the information reqired to satisfy my claims. If you are too lazy or to afraid to seek out the readily available information so you can know what really goes on. That is not my Goddamn problem. Now get lost.

You gave me NO information. You're the one who's lazy: make a claim of prostitute nuns, then don't back it up with SPECIFIC EVIDENCE.

BTW, you're still in diapers around this place, pal. When you've been here a little longer than TEN DAYS, then you can throw your weight around.

Until then, stuff the profanity.

[mware]

I am just so sick of the defaming of Catholic nuns and priests. In Trenton, NJ there was a story that some of the priests are not wearing their collars because of the insults they receive as they wall down the street.

Every group and organization with an axe to grind are coming out of the woodwork.

Keep the Faith my friend.

[sinkspur]

But a news story that appeared in the Pittsburgh Gazette(?) about nine months ago calls that type of arrangement into question. One of these married priests was profiled, and it was implicit that he was on the edge of burn-out. It was explicit that his family was unhappy with the situation -- his responsibilities made it impossible for him to be home more than minimal amounts of time. His wife and children were suffering as a result.

Interesting, but anecdotal.

I know three married Episcopal priests in the Ft. Worth diocese, and they, and their families, are ecstatic at the support they've received and in being in the Catholic Church.

Ask the priest and his wife if they would return to the Episcopalian Church.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

From Thomas Hobbes' Leviathan:

Part IV. Of the Kingdom of Darkness. Chap xlvii. Of the Benefit that proceedeth from such Darkness...

[21] For from the time that the Bishop of Rome had gotten to be acknowledged for bishop universal, by pretense of successsion to St. Peter, their whole hiearchy (or kingdom of darkness) may be compared to the kingdom of fairies (that is, to the old wives' fables in England, concerning ghosts and spirits and the feats they play in the night). And if a man consider the original of this great ecclesiastical dominion, he will easily percieve that the Papacy is no other than the ghost of the deceased Roman empire, sitting crowned upon the grave thereof. For so did the Papacy start up on a sudden out of the ruins of that heathen empire.

[23] The fairies, in what nation soever they converse, have but one universal king, which some poets of ours call King Oberon; but the Scripture calls Beelzebub, prince of demons. The ecclesiastics likewise, in whose dominions soever they be found, acknowledge but one universal king, the Pope.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

From Thomas Hobbes' Leviathan:

Part IV. Of the Kingdom of Darkness. Chap xlvii. Of the Benefit that proceedeth from such Darkness...

[21] For from the time that the Bishop of Rome had gotten to be acknowledged for bishop universal, by pretense of successsion to St. Peter, their whole hiearchy (or kingdom of darkness) may be compared to the kingdom of fairies (that is, to the old wives' fables in England, concerning ghosts and spirits and the feats they play in the night). And if a man consider the original of this great ecclesiastical dominion, he will easily percieve that the Papacy is no other than the ghost of the deceased Roman empire, sitting crowned upon the grave thereof. For so did the Papacy start up on a sudden out of the ruins of that heathen empire.

[23] The fairies, in what nation soever they converse, have but one universal king, which some poets of ours call King Oberon; but the Scripture calls Beelzebub, prince of demons. The ecclesiastics likewise, in whose dominions soever they be found, acknowledge but one universal king, the Pope.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

The article is all wrong, sex with boys is not the same as sex with men.

It is still male/male perversion of human anatomical function and homosexual.

A 30 year old man who sleeps with a 15 year old girl is a pederast, same thing if he does it with a boy, there's nothing homosexual or heterosexual about it.

They are both rape. One is heterosexual. one is homosexual...

[sinkspur]

Hobbes is an authority on exactly what?

[Squire]

I know three married Episcopal priests in the Ft. Worth diocese, and they, and their families, are ecstatic at the support they've received and in being in the Catholic Church.

Interesting but anecdotal. To coin a phrase.

Here are some additional interesting anecdotes: http://www.catholic.net/rcc/Periodicals/Homiletic/June97/clergy.html.

[joathome]

"Celibacy, aside from being a higher state in life in a metaphysical sense, helps the priest to better model the great High Priest, whose instrument He is."

True celibacy teaches the value of sacrifice to the laity. On the downside, I haven't heard one priest yet who could preach about REAL family life the way protestant preachers can. I know they grew up in families, but their experience as a child in a family does NOT translate to the married state.

[Squire]

True celibacy teaches the value of sacrifice to the laity. On the downside, I haven't heard one priest yet who could preach about REAL family life the way protestant preachers can. I know they grew up in families, but their experience as a child in a family does NOT translate to the married state.

Gotta disagree. The average priest gains immense experience in both analyzing and handling family dynamics in and through counseling so many different families. The breadth and depth of the knowledge they acquire on the job is impressive.

[SMEDLEYBUTLER]

The reality is that the Catholic Church lies to the public.

First day back and you're continuing your old ways. Individuals within certain dioceses lie to the public. Of course, you are aware of the actions of Archbishop Chaput in Denver concerning Marshall Gourley, as only one example, but chose to ignore it, didn't you.

[Renatus]

Celibacy, aside from being a higher state in life in a metaphysical sense, helps the priest to better model the great High Priest, whose instrument He is.

Very well said. Thank you.

[Squire]

From Thomas Hobbes' Leviathan: Part IV. Of the Kingdom of Darkness. Chap xlvii. Of the Benefit that proceedeth from such Darkness...

It is simply breathtaking how much schlock writing was produced to oil the English Protestant money-machine and the ersatz aristocracy that patronized it. What drivel! Perhaps the only more amazing thing is that some people actually consider this rubbish serious literature.

But since you're into the "antique," I'll now try to explain my point in the style of Hobbes. Something like this -- "They hath been led astray by an unholy and false nobility, rampant on their gilded thrones, all sprung from the blood-soaked garden of ruined monastery and abbey. Yea, they hath rendered unto Caesar the things of God and, lo, hath fallen prostrate before their own Mammon-God, whose name be "Bourgeois." They hath turned their face against Peter and that unity for which God Himself prayed on that doleful night of waxing evil."

Please do not again post any other Hobbes mediocrities and/or whore-of-Babylon nonsense until you can produce evidence of a single Protestant clergyman whose sanctity in any way rivals that of any pope of the last 400 years.

[The Right Stuff]

I am quite distressed to hear this. I am not really against women in the ranks (being a woman, I never really saw the controversary), but homosexuality is so against church teaching, I just cannot see condoning the behavior.

[Puff the Magic Dragon]

Re: Hobbesian Choice:

Gee, that story turned out nicely...

House of Lords Legalizes Cloning: Christianity Today article

[saradippity]

I am neither confused nor ill informed. I merely asked for scriptural support for non-celibate priests. Anything other than Bible passages,or established tradition or Magisterial teaching is an "aside",given my specific request in the original post.

Yes,I know about the eastern rite churches but I had no idea that there were so few married priests in the Latin rite. One quarter of one per cent is miniscule.Furthermore the reasons for it correlate to scripture aince when they started serving God,they were a part of the Body of Christ that was not in full union with the Catholic Church. When they found the "fullness of truth" they were treated as those early Bishops.No problem there.

And,you are correct in that celibacy is a discipline and could be modified. However,since arguing religion with non-Catholics on Free Republic I have read more scripture than I had in the past. It was this that caused me to start looking for the roots of our beliefs in the Bible. I was surprised to find a "discipline" that was so totally rooted in scripture.

I still say I am sorry that a Catholic that I so often disagree with is as articulate and informed as you. I guess thats a back handed compliment.(o-)That's a wink.