Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Parental advisory: This column discusses 'speech' (Ann Coulter) TRIPLE XXX
worldnetdaily ^ | 4/24/2002 | Ann Coulter

Posted on 04/24/2002 3:56:03 PM PDT by TLBSHOW

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 101-120121-140141-160 ... 221-223 next last
To: jwalsh07
What they have done is chipped away at your freedom again...

Is this an FDR style freedom? "Freedom from want." "Freedom from fear."

How does the Supreme Court saying something is NOT illegal chip away at freedom?

121 posted on 04/25/2002 6:28:13 AM PDT by jimt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: jimt
The freedom for citiznes to govern themselves closest to home, best expressed by the tenth amendment. Something anathema to ideologues and authoritarian types who want all rulings to come from a central authority when they are in favor of that particular ruling.

The ruling regarding virtual child pornography renders unconstitutional laws already enacted by 24 states and so the central government takes even more of your freedom to govern yourself closest to home.

The sad thing is the overwhelming amount of "freedom lovers" who embrace it.

122 posted on 04/25/2002 6:54:46 AM PDT by jwalsh07
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 121 | View Replies]

To: gorush
"...that's why the NEA doesn't teach the Constitution anymore..."

Have they ever ?? ?? ??

123 posted on 04/25/2002 7:00:44 AM PDT by Alabama_Wild_Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Southern Federalist
The issue is original intent. I would say that you are the one reading the Constitution the way liberals do, ignoring the original meaning of its terms in context in order to invent all sorts of rights to fit your a priori libertarian notion of freedom. The original meaning of the First Amendment is the protection of political speech - not pornography

I do not claim that porn is protected speech. I merely point out that Article I, section 8 does not give the federal government the authority to do anything about it. The authority of the federal government is limited to those matters specifically listed in the Constitution. If you paid any attention to the original understanding of the framers, you'd know that.

124 posted on 04/25/2002 9:34:58 AM PDT by Rule of Law
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 108 | View Replies]

To: anniegetyourgun
Yes, now back to reality....

I take it then that you do not believe in constitutional government. In which case, I don't suppose it does much good to continue our discussion. You see, I believe in the Constitution.

125 posted on 04/25/2002 9:38:50 AM PDT by Rule of Law
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies]

To: jwalsh07
If that makes me a leftist, who gives a crap.

The notion that the "commerce clause" allows the federal government to exercise a generalized police power is an error. It is an error perpetuated by the left because they want unlimited federal government. You appear to have fallen into this error. This does not mean that you are a leftist, but you should consider the implications of what you say.

Unfortunately, many "conservatives" have knee-jerk reactions to issues such a pornography, drugs, euthanasia, etc. and are willing to abandon the idea of limited, constitutional government in order to solve this problems. Then they express outrage when liberals use the same doctrines to advance the liberal agenda.

126 posted on 04/25/2002 9:54:23 AM PDT by Rule of Law
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: Rule of Law
Unfortunately, many "conservatives" have knee-jerk reactions to issues such a pornography, drugs, euthanasia, etc. and are willing to abandon the idea of limited, constitutional government in order to solve this problems. Then they express outrage when liberals use the same doctrines to advance the liberal agenda.

You hit the nail on the head with this one . . .

127 posted on 04/25/2002 10:10:33 AM PDT by realpatriot71
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 126 | View Replies]

To: realpatriot71
You hit the nail on the head with this one . . .

Unfortunately, it's all too true. Just look around FR and you'll see loads of people who are willing to discard the Constitution to get their favorite project enacted. They become outraged if you point that fact out and use the same arguments that liberals use.

The sad thing is that they believe there is a real difference between what they say and what the liberals say.

128 posted on 04/25/2002 10:30:05 AM PDT by Rule of Law
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 127 | View Replies]

To: jwalsh07
Of course, if they considered original intent it could not be since the men who crafted the first amendment also endorsed and signed obscentiy laws.

Please refer me to these FEDERAL obscenity laws you refer to.

129 posted on 04/25/2002 10:35:12 AM PDT by FreeTally
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: anniegetyourgun
It's not, but we're talking child porn here -

No, we are not talking about child pornography here. Thats why this discussion gets so many pissed off at you guys. You have no comprehension of what the SCOTUS struck down. It makes you all look so foolish.

130 posted on 04/25/2002 10:37:05 AM PDT by FreeTally
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: jimt
How does the Supreme Court saying something is NOT illegal chip away at freedom?

LOL!! The un-answerable question.

131 posted on 04/25/2002 10:38:31 AM PDT by FreeTally
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 121 | View Replies]

To: Rule of Law
I do not claim that porn is protected speech. I merely point out that Article I, section 8 does not give the federal government the authority to do anything about it.

Insofar as viewing rights to pornography are for sale on the internet, the very nature of the internet makes such sales "commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states" and for that matter with wired "Indian tribes." Unless there were some way for an internet porn site whose administration was located in, say, New Jersey, to guarantee that only New Jersey residents would have access, such a site is engaged in international and interstate commerce. Furthermore, free internet porn sites are typically supported by advertising, largely by pay sites, and so are adjuncts to commerce.

As Justice Story points out in his Commentaries, Article 8 makes no statement whatsoever about the motive for which the regulation of commerce is put in the power of the United States. "A power to regulate commerce is not necessarily a power to advance its interests. It may in given cases suspend its operations and restrict its advancement and scope."

132 posted on 04/25/2002 10:40:04 AM PDT by Southern Federalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 124 | View Replies]

To: TLBSHOW
To think we even have a discussion about this garbage, shows how far America has fallen in the moral ground leadership of the world.

Yep. Well stated. What will be the "free speech" topic in ten years? I shudder to think.

133 posted on 04/25/2002 10:44:25 AM PDT by Skooz
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Rule of Law
Exactly! Liberals and Conservatives are both the same when it comes to personal freedoms and the size of government - it's just that their "pet" projects differ.
134 posted on 04/25/2002 10:44:45 AM PDT by realpatriot71
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 128 | View Replies]

To: keri
"any visual depiction including photographs, film, video, picture, or computer or computer generated image or picture, whether made by or produced by electronic, mechanical, or other means of sexually explicit conduct where visual depiction is, or appears to be a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct. [18U.S.C. 2252A(a)(5)(B)]

This is where the law failed to pass Constitutional muster. As was pointed out in the majority opinion, there are many mainstream (non-pornographic) works that depict minor characters engaged in sexual activity. When this is done for a movie, as an example, an adult actor is chosen to play the part of the minor character. Under 18USC2252(a)(5)(B), that was illegal, even though no minors were involved. In pointing out that the "children" protected by the statute are cartoons, Rush is right (again).

135 posted on 04/25/2002 10:48:17 AM PDT by Redcloak
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 110 | View Replies]

To: Rule of Law
Please show me where in the Constitution the federal government gets authority to regulate it.

The fact that the Supreme Court has ruled on this precludes ANY state or local government from doing so. If the Supreme Court strikes down this law, it cannot be resurrected by any local authority.

I agree with you that the Federal government has no such authority, but now no local government does either.

136 posted on 04/25/2002 10:49:53 AM PDT by Skooz
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: jwalsh07
I'm clear on where I stand. SCOTUS created a first amendment right to virtual kiddie porn out of thin air in another power grab from the states.

Seeing as they struck down a Federal law, how is this a "power grab from the states"?

137 posted on 04/25/2002 10:53:39 AM PDT by Redcloak
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 119 | View Replies]

To: Southern Federalist
Insofar as viewing rights to pornography are for sale on the internet, the very nature of the internet makes such sales "commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states" and for that matter with wired "Indian tribes." Unless there were some way for an internet porn site whose administration was located in, say, New Jersey, to guarantee that only New Jersey residents would have access, such a site is engaged in international and interstate commerce. Furthermore, free internet porn sites are typically supported by advertising, largely by pay sites, and so are adjuncts to commerce.

The interpretation you suggest putting on the commerce clause make a mockery of the whole idea of limited government. Your intepretation leaves the federal government to regulate virtually every facet of our lives. This was not the understanding that the founders had of the authority of the federal government.

One of the rules of statutory construction is that you should interpret statutes in light of the problems the statute sought to address. There were two problems that the commerce clause sought to address.

First, some states were putting tarriffs on goods from other states. Second, some states refused to allow goods from another state entry into their borders. These two issues caused significant problems with trade. These problems were among the main reasons the Constitutional Convention was held.

Reading the commerce clause in light of the problems to be addressed, and in light of the founder's understanding that they were instituting a government of limited authority, you can readily see that the interpretation you suggest is inappropriate.

138 posted on 04/25/2002 10:56:43 AM PDT by Rule of Law
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 132 | View Replies]

To: Rule of Law
Unfortunately, many "conservatives" have knee-jerk reactions to issues such a pornography, drugs, euthanasia, etc. and are willing to abandon the idea of limited, constitutional government in order to solve this problems. Then they express outrage when liberals use the same doctrines to advance the liberal agenda.

I've long contended that this is the difference between liberals and consrevatives: Liberals like their big government slathered on from left to right while conservatives prefer it slathered on from right to left.

139 posted on 04/25/2002 10:57:10 AM PDT by Redcloak
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 126 | View Replies]

To: Skooz
The fact that the Supreme Court has ruled on this precludes ANY state or local government from doing so. If the Supreme Court strikes down this law, it cannot be resurrected by any local authority.

I concur with the result reached by the court, but I would dissent with the reasoning. Application of the 1st Amendment was inappropriate in this case. Perhaps Mr. Justice Thomas's concurring opinion points that out.

Be that as it may, the 1st Amendment does not legitimately apply to the states. Though I know that the court will apply it. Perhaps this would be a good test case for a state nullifying an unconstitutional decision of the Supreme Court.

140 posted on 04/25/2002 11:01:39 AM PDT by Rule of Law
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 136 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 101-120121-140141-160 ... 221-223 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson