Bigotry in Print. Crowds Chant Murder. Something's Changed.

The Forward ^ | 5/24/02 | PAUL BERMAN

[Restorer]

He pointed to the story of David and Goliath, which, though commonly pictured as a tale of underdog triumph, is actually the story of a blond person (David's blond hair seemed to catch Saramago's attention) employing a superior technology to kill at a distance a helpless and presumably non-blond person, the unfortunate and oppressed Goliath.

Actually, David vs. Goliath is much more like a Hungarian freedom fighter with a Molotov cocktail against a Soviet tank. He might possibly win, but he hardly wields a "superior technology."

David had one shot to hit a probably four inch square target or seconds later Goliath would have chopped him into very small pieces.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

I've found, though, that the more orthodox the Jew is the more likely he or she is to accept a convert as a real Jew, as long as the conversion was performed under orthodox auspices. In fact, the rabbi who converted my wife noted that the vast majority of converts knew of having Jewish ancestry (including my wife) and saw conversion as more of a return than a change.

It is the more reform Jews, in my experience, who are more likely to consider a convert "Not a real Jew," especially for not having had to face discrimination. It's a liberal-left group identity sort of thing.

[Restorer]

More about blondes.

The Philistines were apparently northern invaders from what is now the vicinity of Greece, perhaps Mycenean refugees. Goliath was a lot more likely to have been blond than David was.

[Eva]

I agree with you about the racial component. It is the reason that Judaism spurns proselytizing. It is also the reason that the Jews are vastly outnumbered by the Islamic world. The focus of Judaism is not to rule the world, as it is in Islam, but rather to be allowed to live in peace and maintain their relative racial purity as the chosen people of God in the land that was promised to them.

[Restorer]

relative racial purity

Bit of an oxymoron, don't you think? Somewhat like "relative virginity?"

Even a cursory reading of the OT will show that the Jews were an extremely mixed group long before the time of Christ.

[LarryLied]

I could cite a dozen other instances where, in the last few weeks, someone in a city like New York or Washington, London or Paris, has argued or chanted in favor of mass murder

The Forward is not one to complain. Check out this puff piece they wrote recently on Isaac Babel, an accomplice to genocide.

[Eva]

No, it's not an oxymoron, because no race is 100% pure. There is, afterall a tribe of black Jews in Africa and David was desribed as fair. That doesn't exactly sound like racial purity.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

BTTT

[headsonpikes]

bump

[Ethan_Allen]

Interesting post. It tempted me to spend the last few hours at blueletterbible.org. I have to get off, now, but a couple of points:

Re: the "helpless....unfortunate and oppressed" Goliath of the Philistines:

The character of the Philistines: www.blueletterbible.org/tmp_dir/choice/1022720628.html

The Philistines were idolators: 1 Sam. 5:2 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/1Sa/1Sa005.html#top) and Judges 16:23. Samson and the Dagon Fish god (engraving) http://blueletterbible.org/images/bible_images/Samson/samson_fishgod1.html

The battle - the Philistines and Goliath were looking for trouble: http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/1Sa/1Sa017.html#1

A commentary on David and the battle: http://www.blueletterbible.org/tmp_dir/comm_read/1022722704.html

Has this guy accepted Jesus Christ? No? Then he sounds like the scribes and Pharisees whom Jesus condemned in Matt. 23:30: "And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets." (or of the blood of Jesus?) Matthew 23, a great chapter: http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mat/Mat023.html

The scribes and Pharisees http://www.blueletterbible.org/tmp_dir/choice/1022708248.html were probably of the group Jesus was referring to when he said "ye who say ye are Jews, but are not Jews, but are of the synagogue of Satan". (Rev. 2:9, and Rev. 3:9). A multitude of Jews DID believe and were saved (Acts 2:4 - 3 thousand, Acts 4:4 - 5 thousand, to name two instances). In Matthew 23:39, He said to the scribes and Pharisees: "For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord", (and they will - Psalm 22/John 19:37) as the MULTITUDE did in Matthew 21:8-11 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mat/Mat021.html. If these people would get out of their Satanic bible and get into the real thing, we'd ALL be better off.

One more thought: The Real Enemy of the Arabs (You have to scroll down) http://watch.pair.com/Israel.html. While at watch.pair, see their article on the Lost Tribe of Dan, (http://watch.pair.com/Dan.html). It will make the David and Goliath story even more interesting. The Philistines extended on the Mediterrean coast from Joppa to Gaza. On one map, Joppa is in Dan.

[monkeyshine]

bump

This is a good article. It exposes the shallowness of thought that exists on practically every level of the Israel-Palestinian discussion, from the man on the street to the so called "intellectuals", they just don't think things through very clearly, and have not studied the history very well, and do not consider the consequences of their propositions.

[Alouette]

every ridiculous left-wing sect selling its sacred texts, side by side with sober European social democrats and American liberals.

You are known by the company you keep.

[Phillip Augustus]

I could have done without the inclusion of Serbia with Syria and Iraq. That was a vicious, cheap attack.

[Phillip Augustus]

Lew Rockwell is as far from a Communist as one can possibly be.

[Phillip Augustus]

The article suggests that it would improper for any foreign influnce to have a say in Israel's immigration policy (see, his comments on the Jewish right to return). Why do I get a sneaking suspicion that the author would condemn a similar immigration policy if a European nation practiced it? Could there be a double standard here?

[Alouette]

Many Jews don't consider converts to be "real Jews."

Any non-Jew who converts according to Jewish law is a "Real Jew." There are some non-Jews who convert through schismatic sects (called "Reform" "Reconstructionist" "Conservative" etc. who do not believe in the Bible, or observe the commandments.) who are not Jews because:

1. They don't practice or believe in Judaism.
2. Their "conversion" was not conducted according to Jewish law.

Once these converts come in line with Jewish law they are "Real Jews" no ifs ands or buts.

Finished. Period. End of story.

I'm not approving or condemning either side here, just pointing out facts.

I just pointed out facts. What you did was tell a falsehood.

[Oschisms]

Sadly the headline is wrong. Ain't a damn thing changed.

[rmlew]

The jokeof course is that David was not blond, being a Semite. It was Goliath, who as a Hellenic Philistine, was of European descent.

[Alouette]

The jokeof course is that David was not blond, being a Semite.

David was not even a "racially pure" Israelite. He was a descendant of Ruth, a Moabite convert.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

Any non-Jew who converts according to Jewish law is a "Real Jew."

According to Jewish law, yes.

As the husband of a convert, I note that there are a fair number of Jews (usually of a left-of-center political persuasion), who don't consider a convert to be a "real Jew" because they haven't "grown up with discrimination" or some sort of related PC claptrap.

Unfortunately, they're often the sort of loud-mouthed a$$holes who can make someone feel rather uncomfortable.