Posted on 07/09/2002 7:37:02 PM PDT by Clive
Snipers did not keep score to be the best and I doubt if any would claim to be the best. Hatlcock ,in his Viet Nam element, may have been the best there but he, compared to say Francis Pegahmagabow ,an Native from Ontario with 378 or Henry Norwest from Saskatchewan with 115 ,was no better than they in theirs. Theirs being mud and shell holes of WW1 with a good chance of being shot at in return. Other than WW2 what is known about Lyudmila Pavlichenko and her 309 kills? She ,in her own environment, may well have been the best.
http://www.snipercentral.com/snipers.htm
At least these guys didn't tell the media their names were Terrence and Philip.
Hold down the fort Carlos. We're coming.
Garde la Foi, mes amis! Nous nous sommes les sauveurs de la République! Maintenant et Toujours!
(Keep the Faith, my friends! We are the saviors of the Republic! Now and Forever!)
LonePalm, le Républicain du verre cassé (The Broken Glass Republican)
To make a long story short, the results were that the Germans were the most accurate, the Americans next, then the British, Japanese then the Russians. He commented specifically about Saburo Sakai and his supposed 61 kills. He basically said no one who has checked really believes that.
He also commented that he didn't think any of them were purposely lying only doing a sloppy job of verification with one exception. The Russian claims had no relationship at all to reality. He said they were basically just made up.
I suspect the same would be true of their sniper claims
So we'll forget about Lyudmila, justified or not, and use Matthias Hetzenauer(345) or Heinz Thorvald (300). Perhaps Sepp Allerberger(257),Gefreiter Meyer(180) or Oleh Dir (120). All good German snipers. Scores weren't my point. All snipers dealt with environment. Each, if he lived , used it to his advantage. As good as Hatcock was in hs environment the others , German in the case of WW2 , were as good in theirs. They lived. Would Hatcock have survived on the fields of Flanders or the rubble of Stalingrad ? Or our good Germans the jungles of Asia? We'll never know . There is no best.
I read the book, about Carlos Hathcock, I think it was titled "Marine Sniper" and his accomplishments were spectacular. I recall one incident in which he and his spotter just about wiped out an NVA company. (His spotter was using an M14 and may have got more than Hathcock.) I don't think any of these were counted as confirmed kills.
Shooting Russians in the rubble of a burned out city is different than stalking individuals in the jungle. Who knows? I do know I wouldn't want any of them after me.
Not to bust your bubble, but Gunny's first shot hit the bicycle, the second shot nabbed the target.
Sometimes I wonder if that hasn't been the objective of the MSM and the gun-grabbers all along.
but with an non-accurazied Ma-duce at that range, still the best 2 shot group I have heard of.
It's d@mned good!, no doubt!
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