There Must Be Some Way Out Of Here

The Economist ^ | July 18, 2002 | Staff - Print edition

[2sheep]

"We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." —President John Adams, second President of the United States addressing the U.S. military, October 11, 1798

[Avoiding_Sulla]

"We have no government armed ... capable"

That won't prevent Statists from attempting it though.

"...Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people."

That's why witting and unwitting agents of Statism try so hard to break down each individual's moral fiber. Their temptations assault us on many fronts at once. The more who behave outside the bounds of decency the greater the apparent need to crack down on everybody. As a result "innocent until proven guilty" has been in the cross-hairs for some time now. How much remains?

You've obviously compiled, as have I, evidence demonstrating the malthusian driven megalomaniacal intentions of the world elite.
What surer way to kill off large chunks of population than to let it enslave itself with its own unbridled passions? A corralled herd is more easily culled than free men who can still fight back.

Is your screenname somehow connected with attempts to awaken what manhood remains in men who've permitted themselves to be morphed into sheeple?

[Eustace]

Even our churches that aren't in these groups have been silenced , by our government and their "Policy of the day". Through incorporation our churches have become state churches , something that Christian's in Rome refused to do , and paid the price.

Instead of being Tax Free which they are because they are Churches , they have accepted the "tax exempt" status from the government. They can lose their tax exemption status if they go against government/pagan policies.

Hitler said "Tell a lie long enough and people will believe it."

Chruches believing that "tax exemption" granted by government is innocent is one of those lies.

Silent Churches

"The UN's doctrine of tolerence and diversity."

Stalin said America would be taken down by a "War of Concessions" different words same end.

Inncidently (as I'm sure you know) the UN is another of those lies that Hitler talked about.

As far as these churches corrupting our Churches , I think You have to go back to Constintine as the beginning of the corruption. With the introduction of pagan idols and pagan celebration days to increase the churches members.

I describe how I came to Christ , by saying I came through the "back door". I didn't discover Him in Gods' Word , I discovered Him after I discovered the "evil" He faced for us. When I found the "evil" He defeated for us , I knew He was real.

That's when I understood His Love for us.

I'm not trying to preach to the choir , I can't. I don't read the Bible.

I'm relying on my Faith in Christ to guide me.

I don't believe for a second that God put us here to suffer at the hands of His enemies. Even though that is a role Christians have accepted for thousands of years. Even today being slaughtered in Africa.

There was one time I heard where Christ hid from His enemies , and that was so Scripture could be fullfilled.

I believe like Christ , we need to come together as ONE CHURCH IN GODS' NAME AND FOR GODS' HONOR and drag His enemies into His Light where they will crumble. And there is no doubt in my mind that they will crumble in His Light.

These barbarians need to accomplish what they do , in secret. If people knew half of what they have done , they would drag them into the streets and make examples out of them.

That's what they fear , TRUTH. And the TRUTH leads to God. That is why they must separate us from our God with such things as diversity and incorporation as Ceasar did.

There's no doubt in my mind that we can stop them and change the ending of the Bible. But "We" have to stand together in His name as one Church and for His honor , placing Him back above man.

Only then will we be able to defeat man's corrupt laws that will enslave and eventually destroy us.

Basically , "we" have to STAND UP WITH CHRIST and do what must be done , instead of sitting on our hands and waiting for Him to do it for us. I believe in my heart He will walk with us and we will win.

Peace

[Uncle Bill]

Consumer Confidence at Five-Month Low

Consumer gloom hits US economy

Consumer Confidence Plunges

Liar's Solitaire

History of Bull Markets Rife With Folly - The worst of this episode isn't behind us

The folks on Wall Street say this time will be different. That this rally will last. If history doesn't provide the proper context for that pipedream, maybe valuations will.

America's 500 biggest stocks are selling for anywhere between 25 and 40 times one year's earnings, depending on how one accounts for nonrecurring charges. Even at the cheap end of that range, the S&P 500 ($SPX: news, chart, profile) is still selling for more than twice the historical average for a bear-market low.

The highest price-earnings ratio seen at a major market bottom during the past 60 years is approximately 12.5, technician Paul F. Desmond at Lowry's Reports tells me. That was in June 1962. (Read more about tops and bottoms.)

Next time a guy tells you this time will be different, ask if he or she works for a brokerage, investment bank, pension fund or mutual fund manager. If the answer is no, ask when was the last time they made money in this market of sick stocks.

CORPORATE CHEATS

Has scandal taught big business a lesson?

a. Yes, they've learned the hard way--------(25%)

b. No, they'll get off easy and do it again-------------------------(60%)

c. I'm not sure------(15%)

Snap-back Rally Masks Continuing Bear Market

Banking Crisis Grips Uruguay

Junk Bond Defaults at Record - Moody's

ChevronTexaco misses target

US CREDIT OUTLOOK-Economy and looming debt supply back in focus

Property bubble kept afloat by rising house prices

Japan's Deflation: The Similarities Are Unsettling - Business Week

[2sheep]

>Is your screenname somehow connected...

We are "2" because we are two and "sheep" because we follow the L-rd and not the god of this World nor false shepherds/wolves sent to deceive the sheep.  Herd mentality is a dangerous thing.

There have been many signs of a coming crash and I have posted those often, i.e., trains de-railing and going over cliffs, buses crashing, decks falling into the ocean, fires at Cache Mt. and so on.  Here's just one:  89.  It is harvest time in the land.  The Hayman fire and a big Rodeo (corral) fire and these speak of far worse to come...the fire of persecution by the one worlders taking over.

Uncle Bill has been writing about this economic crash for several years and unforunately, his threads often have little traffic.  Others threads go to the 100's or 1000's which are examples of the Delphi Technique and Hegelian Dialectic in practice to deceive Freepers every day -- threads which excite the emotions such as the child murder threads or those which bait Rep/Dem (as if they represented Good/Evil, when they do not).  A friend just sent this link:   So, Have You Been Delphi'd? -- There is more here:  LEARN.   People should not only think outside the box, but get outside the box.  Sodom is on fire.

[Crazymonarch]

MEET THE MONSTER IN THE BASEMENT

[Uncle Bill]

SEC - Statements by Company CEOs and CFOs
The CEO/CFO Swear-In Watch

---

"This expansion will run forever,"
Rudi Dornbusch - MIT economics professor - July 30, 1998, Wall Street Journal.

"We don't want one, we don't need one, and, as we have the tools to keep the current expansion going, we won't have one."
Rudi Dornbusch - MIT economics professor - July 30, 1998, Wall Street Journal. Regarding The U.S. having a recession.

"Thus, only natural causes, and not the Fed, can bring the economy to a standstill. Fortunately, we have the monetary and fiscal resources to keep that from happening, as well as a policy team that won't hesitate to use them for continued expansion."
Rudi Dornbusch - MIT economics professor - July 30, 1998, Wall Street Journal.
Source

Forecasting Crashes and Recessions

"Something Unanticipated Happened"

Where's The Risk?
"And there are dangers that institutions take bets on particular risk models that turn out to be wrong. Long-Term Capital Management nearly collapsed in 1998 after the Russian default undermined its investment assumptions. Similar mistakes could emerge if others have taken on too much bank credit, assuming the extraordinary bubble of the 1990s would continue for longer."

Tuesday, 7/30 Market Wrapup

Oil Giant's Quarter Net Slumps 81%

Mirant Says It Overstated as Much as $253 Million

Providian Financial to close 3 offices, lay off 1,300 workers

Vanguard Airlines Files for Bankruptcy and Suspends Service

Venture capital investments fall to lowest level in nearly 4 years

S&P Keeps Sell on Sprint

AOL Under DOJ Scrutiny

Upheaval at Bertelsmann May End Plans for Acquisition of Napster

Fuji Film Posts 48 Percent Profit Fall

Asian Stocks Stumble on U.S. Data

Showdown Is Set on Bank Guarantees in Japan

Swiss Billionaire Ebner Gives Up his Funds After Their Value Plunged 50%

BBVA Second-Quarter Profit Falls 20% on Investment Losses, Drop in Lending

U.S. Second-Quarter Growth Probably Slowed as Consumers Cut Back Spending

Brazil's Economy Falters as Customers, Companies Cope With Currency Slide

Budget Deficit in Philippines Damages Investor Confidence

Doughty, Apax, Other Buyout Firms Pull Share Offerings as Returns Decline

GE CEO Jeffrey Immelt Juggles Demands for Clearer Accounts

Nvidia Declines as Sales Drop; Stock Futures Fall: After-Hours

Merrill Lynch & Co. Inc. Execs Take Fifth

I.B.M. to Purchase Consulting Group for $3.5 Billion

Israel's Security Chief Avi Dichter Says 60 Suicide Attacks Being Planned

As the Dollar Slumps, Whither the Stock Market?

[Avoiding_Sulla]

Reply #3 at one of your links (So, Have You Been Delphi'd?)
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a37b321093ce6.htm#3
has a plan for counteracting group think schemers similar to one I proposed at "How Would You Go About Truly Reforming Our Political Parties?" http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3bdb5b6b391b.htm where I broke down the task into subtasks that began with attending what you might see as group-think functions (such as county party caucuses) with your own loyal subgroup.

Lynn Stuter obviously has studied this (I'd be interested in how much of it is academic) has provided some excellent countermeasure guidelines. My suggestions arose from analyzing my own and friends' experiences, are mostly empirical.

More contributions like ours, and a little synthesis on the part of people like you, and we can build and sustain vital influence that would be harder to ignore.

[Uncle Bill]

The revised figures for 2001 now show that instead of contracting for just the third quarter, the economy actually shrank — although modestly — for three straight quarters. The new figures show that the economy contracted by 0.6 percent in last year's first quarter, by 1.6 percent in the second quarter and by 0.3 percent in the third quarter."

New Report Shows U.S. Economy Slowed Significantly for Quarter

U.S. Economy: Second-Quarter Growth Slows to 1.1%

Andy Fastow - Enron's off-balance-sheet partnerships known as LJM2 - "Do I know everything that's going on? Do I have to sign off on every deal that goes in there? Yes," he says. "I'm in the unique position of not having the ownership or the responsibility or obligation to sell the assets, but I know everything about them, and I've been involved in their approval and maybe in their structuring."

No indictments yet in Enron case; maybe never

AOL Time Warner Hit by 2nd Federal Probe

Deutsche Bank's 2nd-Quarter Net Profit Fell 76% Amid Weak Global Economy

Deutsche Bank, BNP, Barclays Earnings Slide; Say Outlook Is `Challenging'

Verizon Loss Widens; Cuts Outlook

Tokyo stocks fall again as U.S. GDP disappoints

Asia Markets Sluggish on US GDP 'Downer'

July 31, 2002 - Wednesday's Stock Market WrapUp

[2sheep]

More than a fender-bender bump.

CLINTON ADMINISTRATION HAS REINVENTED COMMUNISM
December 5, 2000

  Mr. Speaker, America's trade deficit for September hit $35 billion for one month, $35 billion. America is heading for a $420 billion, 1-year trade deficit.  Unbelievable. If this continues, America will have a crash that will make 1929 look like a fender-bender.  What is even worse, China is now taking $100 billion of cash out of our economy, buying missiles, and pointing them at us.

  Beam us up, all of us.  We must be stupid. Ronald Reagan almost destroyed Communism, and the Clinton administration has reinvented it, is now subsidizing it, and is now stabilizing it.  I yield back any common sense left and any patriotism left in this Congress.  ... James Traficant

[2sheep]

>More contributions like ours, and a little synthesis on the part of people like you, and we can build and sustain vital influence that would be harder to ignore.

Ah...Hegelian-speak!  The Towers of Babel/Babylon have fallen and crashed in the marketplace.  They cannot be rebuilt by consensus.

 LEARN - Homepage
 About Consensus and Facilitation
 Delphi Technique
 The Delphi Technique. What Is It?
 The Delphi Technique: How to Disrupt It
 What's Wrong With Consensus
 What American Citizens Need to Know About Consensus and Facilitation
 The Process
 The Community of Sixty
 Dean Gotcher on Consensus Building

[Uncle Bill]

Is The U.S. Already Bankrupt?

HOW BIG IS THE GOVERNMENT'S DEBT? - $33.1 TRILLION

[PGalt]

Thanks for the update.

[Avoiding_Sulla]

More contributions like ours, and a little synthesis on the part of people like you, and we can build and sustain vital influence that would be harder to ignore.

Ah...Hegelian-speak! ...They cannot be rebuilt by consensus.

<LOL>
Well, just in case your not joking, I'll play along.

You of course realize that the word synthesis is older than Hegel?
Do you shun plants because they engage in photosynthesis?
Even useful hardware comes from synthesis -- e.g., photo+copier.

Whole ideas spring from the synthesis of theory with experimentation. Enormous progress springs from joining academic inquiry with empirical experience. It's not all the result of thesis and antithesis you know. Better yet, check your dictionary. Your definition is a late addition and hasn't rendered the original meaning obsolete. (Just as my life has not lost all gaity because I'm not homosexual<G>)

I pray you get my, er, drift. See, even analogies and metaphors (like "beat a dead horse" comes to mind for some reason) rely on synthesis of a current situation with a vivid image. My life and writing would sure be dull without them.

And come to think of it. Just which one of us responding like the Hegelian student here? <G> Perhaps you've become the anti-Hegelian? You've been studying it so long you've adopted a Hegelian view-point of all processes? Better be careful there -- your ideas may be coalesced and absorbed into the basis of the next thesis. <G>

Look, without a predetermined outcome, the synthesis of which I wrote had to with sparking new inspiration, not excision and elimination so as not to interfere with a predetermined goal.

Now, after all that, instead of a negative response, perhaps following my suggestion to compare and contrast those two links for common and uncommon ideas just could be safe? <G>

[Uncle Bill]

Senate Passes $355 Billion Defense Spending Bill

"I place economy among the first and most important of republic virtues, and public debt as the greatest of the dangers to be feared."
Thomas Jefferson to William Plumer, 1816.

"The burden of debt is as destructive to freedom as subjugation by conquest."
Benjamin Franklin

---

Dow Closes Down 230, Nasdaq Drops 48

Markets Tumble

Stocks Fall Amid Renewed Fears About the Economy

Weak Economic Data Heightened Investors' Fears

Dollar Lower

Dollar Sinks on Gloomy Economic Outlook

Merrill Lynch is once again in a heap of trouble

Two former WorldCom executives were arrested and charged Thursday with hiding billions in expenses and lying to investors and regulators

Walt Disney Co. on Thursday reported a sharp drop in its quarterly net income

Morgan Stanley to cut 200 banking jobs

Ex-UBS Banker Walder Pleads Guilty To Embezzling $70 Million

John Hancock Posts 46% Drop in 2nd-Quarter Net, Cuts 2002 Outlook

Economy: Jobless claims rise as growth in manufacturing slows

GLOBAL ECONOMY-Glum U.S., European factory data a worry

Stocks in U.S. Fall as Reports Suggest Economy, Profits May Be Faltering

Factory Growth Stalls, Recovery in Doubt

Adobe Shares Drop 30 Pct After Warning

Universal Profit Falls, CEO to Retire

PG&E Corp. shares fell as much as 42 percent, the biggest drop since at least 1980

Exxon, Shell Tumble on Weak Fuel Prices>

Stocks plunge in Mexico, down in Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Venezuela

Economic Crisis Swells in S. America

Uruguay Closes All Banks After Currency Falls 55%

Uruguay Extends Bank Closure

Looting in poor district of Uruguayan capital as crisis deepens

Brazil heading for a meltdown a la Argentina

Mexico stocks down 4.41 at year-low on economy woes

Venezuelans Brace for Coup Trial - Chavistas Threaten To Storm Supreme Court

Bay Street in the red again

Accounting Controls On EU Budget 'Unreliable'

Three BIG Words: Revision, Recession, and Intervention

[2sheep]

>Well, just in case your not joking,...

I was joking.  Some might think that is a rare event.  Not joking, however about the following:

Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Remember the old time cartoon of an angel on one shoulder and a devil on the other?  America has yielded itself continually for a long time to various forms of idolatry in its worship of Mammon -- hedonism, materialism, pride, selfishness, and every evil and sexual perversity under the sun.  The few who remain who want good are appalled to see the country given over to socialist monsters who are not interested in the public good but in totalitarianism and slavery.  Those one worlders will embrace their false prophet, Islam, and  require that the whole world worship their beast system and will put a boot to the head of all resistors.  As long as the Power Elite silence or eliminate the ones who expose their lies, writing to one's Congressmen is a waste of time.  Congressmen should be renamed Transgressors...they have kicked out good and love their Barabbas to whom they bow. 

The rich men of the earth who hide out in the Caymans enjoying their ill-gotten gains should party hard and enjoy every fresh breeze they can.  Where they are ultimately going is going to be Hot and forever.  One of the founders said of the republic..."if you can keep it" or something like that.  America didn't keep it.  There are serious consequences.  Consensus may be comforting, but it is probably too late.  Even Lot had to leave town.

 Will Americans Vote For Communists, or Socialists, Or Fascists For NWO? - Of Course They Will

[Uncle Bill]

August 1, 2002 - Market Wrap Up

"Scenes are now to take place as will open the eyes of credulity and of insanity itself, to the dangers of a paper medium abandoned to the discretion of avarice and of swindlers."
Thomas Jefferson to Thomas Cooper, 1814. ME 14:189.

"A spirit... of gambling in our public paper has seized on too many of our citizens, and we fear it will check our commerce, arts, manufactures, and agriculture, unless stopped."
Thomas Jefferson to William Carmichael, 1791. ME 8:230.

"We are now taught to believe that legerdemain tricks upon paper can produce as solid wealth as hard labor in the earth. It is vain for common sense to urge that nothing can produce but nothing; that it is an idle dream to believe in a philosopher's stone which is to turn everything into gold, and to redeem man from the original sentence of his Maker, 'in the sweat of his brow shall he eat his bread.'"
Thomas Jefferson to Charles Yancey, 1816. ME 14:381.

"Congress passed the Federal Reserve Act on the 22nd of December 1913, and from that day forward the United States of America ceased to be a republic."
Anne Williamson - The FED - March 2001 - WorldNet - Vol.10, No. 3.

SEE CHART: Federal, State and Local Welfare Spending - 1929-2000

SEE CHART: The Dollars Devaluation - The Purchasing Power of a single U.S. dollar

How Big Is The Government's Debt? - $33.1 Trillion

TAX REPORT

In 1913 a man gathers up his family and moves from Kentucky to another state far away. He has his lovely wife, and six children to take care of. This is a great challenge, as he has virtually no money, and worse, only an 8th grade education.

Upon arrival, he begins the hunt for a variety of jobs. Within a short time he lands two labor jobs. He works both jobs for some time. He then finds a solid position for a logging company, where he performs a variety of tasks including falling, rigging, operating heavy equipment, etc.

By now, a few years later, he has added two more children to his quiver, for a grand total of eight children. He has bounced from apartment, to rentals, to a rental farm where he is finally happy and content.

He refuses to let his wife work. He and she are content and happy with her taking care of the home and the children, while he provides for the family.

One day he is approached by the landlord, who he has known for some time, to buy the small 25 acre farm. His first instinct is no. He refuses to go into debt. Debt to him was an enemy, a heavy load, slavery in motion. The landlord will sell the acreage for $35 an acre, the home for $650. That's $875 for the land and $650 for the home with everything included. Grand total: $1525. The man had half of that amount. He agreed with the landlord that he would give him the $1525 within a two year time period. No loans, no papers, just a handshake.

He sold a few things, saved his money, plus the money he had already saved, and through hard work gave the landlord the full price, even beating the deadline.

Years thereafter, he purchased 20-30 acre tracts adjoining his property one at a time, until he had 380+ acres, he built a new smaller home, added a huge barn, purchased a tractor, accumulated large heads of cattle, horses, and put in the best fencing available throughout the entire farm. The river and large creek that run through the property provided excellent irrigation for the crops in the fields. The dirt is so rich and dark, you would do a double-take when you saw it. TV? What was that.

For the most part, the farm was self-sufficient. Deer and even elk could easily be killed on the farm, or surrounding timber areas. Timber? That's old growth timber, that you could walk barefoot through, and see the awesome handiwork of God Almighty.

They worked this farm through the Great Depression, world war and troubles of all kinds. One child died. But seven lived to a ripe old age. This man, even when old, often stated, he could breathe out here.

So, his wife never held a job. She never finished high school. She married him at 15 years of age. She worked terribly hard on the farm, and, well, raising eight kids, speaks for itself. If cooking is an IQ, she was a genius. She never missed a day of church. She read books and studied all of her life, and wisdom flowed from her soul. Neighbors from miles around would ask her of many things knowing they would receive an answer. He had an 8th grade education. His work ethic was legend. He bought a small farm and gradually turned it into a 380 acre spread, with tractors and attachments, farm machinery, a new home, cattle, horses, well, fencing, etc. He didn't borrow a dime in his whole life. No loans, no banks, no credit, zip. He did this within an approximate 30 year timeframe.

Now, I challenge a young blue collar worker with an 8th grade education, no money, a young wife with little education, and 8 kids, to move to another state, with no job prospects, to find a job(s), purchase a small farm, turn that farm into a 300-400 acre spread, with tractors, machinery, a new home, cattle, horses, fencing, etc., without ever borrowing money from anybody, and do it within approximately 30 years. Good luck.

What changed?

[Inspector Harry Callahan]

That's quite a story Unc. Thanks for sharing it.

[happygrl]

Uncle Bill, thanks for providing these links and the education therein.

For those who think it can't happen here, Ninevah and Babylon were once great centers of civilization.

There are thousands of unexcavated "tells" in the Middle East which were once thriving cities.

The moving hand writes, and then moves on.

Tene, tene, tekel uupharsin...

[Uncle Bill]

"A global financial implosion is occurring, and it is forcing all major stock markets on earth into full retreat."

Revisions Show Recession Was Deeper

Dow Falls 302 points But Plunge Protection Team Lends A Hand

Economic Worries Slams Stocks

Stocks Slammed For Second Day

Dubya's Double Dip

STOCKS TUMBLE - "It's the fear of a double-dip recession," - Fox News

‘Double-dip’ recession fears return

Double dip talk

Hong Kong Shares End Lower, Cautious On US Double-Dip Recession

A Market Going Nowhere Fast

Handwriting is on the Street’s wall

Few Stock Funds Escape July Market Slide

Market ends week in a skid

Stocks find little relief after hours

Chip Stocks Pounded Lower

US Corp Bonds-Weaker with stocks, economic worries

Gold stocks soared Friday

U.S. shares pummeled by weak jobs data

Goldman Becomes First Wall Street Firm to Predict Fed Rate Cut This Year

Weak U.S. data spurs talk of Fed rate cut

A federal judge warned the Bush administration Friday he would reject any White House effort to block the release of records on Vice President Dick Cheney's energy task force

AOL Time Warner shares drop on reports of PurchasePro inquiry

National Semiconductor Lowers Q1 Revenue Forecast

Worries About Economy Fuel Another Selloff on Wall Street

Weak Job Growth Spells Recession

Weak Economy Churns Out Few Jobs in July

Factory Orders See Big Drop

Economic Reports Are Disappointing, and Shares Plunge

Treasury Yields Fall on Talk of Rate Cut

BUDGET BLOWOUT - Bush Signs $28.9 Billion in Emergency Spending

Disney - Operating income drops 26%

Media networks division down 40%

Sales slump spurs layoffs at Sony Music

Cigna Income Falls 15 Percent

Cisco Investors Anticipate Weak Sales

Viacom shares tumble in broad market sell-off

Deputy AG Profited Before Stock Fell: Thompson Exercised Providian Options During Transition

U.S. Business Loans Fall

Airline stocks in down spiral again

GenVec Quarterly Loss Grows 84%

Conseco stock tumbles after a debt rating dowgrade

Asia Markets Tumble

Treasury Secretary Paul H. O'Neill signaled that the United States was now willing to back bailout plans for two of the hardest-hit South American economies, Brazil and Uruguay

Venezuela Calls Out National Guard After Chavez Supporters Attack Police

Problems in Argentina, Brazil mean trouble for region

DESTROYING EVIDENCE - Wall St. Banks May Be Fined for Discarding E-Mail Traffic

N.Y.S.E. Abandons Plan to Build New Headquarters Across the Street

Stock Woes Send Web Surfers to Financial Sites

Consumer Credit: Is a Crunch Coming?