Bonds Hits 600!!!

KNBR radio | August 9th, 2002 | Sabertooth

[Sabertooth]

Bonds Hits 600!!!

Barry Bonds became just the fourth man in
Major League History to amass 600 career home runs.

.

[rdb3]

Prove it.

Okay. You asked for it.

No joshing about Gibson's talents
By Larry Schwartz
Special to ESPN.com

---

Often it is difficult to distinguish fact from fiction -- especially regarding statistics -- when it comes to players of the Negro League. But there is no disputing the accomplishments of Josh Gibson, whose batting feats are legendary.

	Before dying at age 35, three months before Jackie Robinson's major-league debut, Josh Gibson had proven to Negro League followers that he was one of the game's greats.

Voted into the Hall of Fame in 1972 by the Committee on Negro Baseball Leagues, the right-handed hitting catcher never received the opportunity to show his stuff in the major leagues because he was an African-American. He died at the age of 35 in early 1947, three months before Jackie Robinson made his historic major-league debut with the Brooklyn Dodgers.

Gibson is often referred to as the black Babe Ruth for his ability to hit tape-measure homers, and he also hit for incredibly high averages.

"He hits the ball a mile," Hall of Famer Walter Johnson, the Washington Senators pitcher who won 416 games, said of Gibson.

Satchel Paige, who was Gibson's teammate on the Pittsburgh Crawfords and later pitched for the Cleveland Indians, said, "He was the greatest hitter who ever lived."

In various publications, the 6-foot-1, 215-pounder has been credited with as many as 84 homers in one season. His Hall of Fame plaque says he hit "almost 800" homers in his 17-year career. His lifetime batting average was higher than .350, with one book putting it at .384, best in Negro League history.

It was reported that he won nine home-run titles and four batting championships playing for the Crawfords and the Homestead Grays. In two seasons in the late 1930s, it was written that not only did he hit higher than .400, but his slugging percentage was above 1.000.

Belting home runs of more than 500 feet was not unusual for Gibson. One homer in Monessen, Pa., reportedly was measured at 575 feet. The Sporting News of June 3, 1967 credits Gibson with a home run in a Negro League game at Yankee Stadium that struck two feet from the top of the wall circling the center field bleachers, about 580 feet from home plate. Although it has never been conclusively proven, Chicago American Giants infielder Jack Marshall said Gibson slugged one over the third deck next to the left field bullpen in 1934 for the only fair ball hit out of the House That Ruth Built.

Gibson was born Dec. 21, 1911 in Buena Vista, Ga., and his family reportedly moved to Pittsburgh in the 1920s. By the time he was a teenager, Gibson was playing semipro baseball. His professional career began at the age of 18 under unusual circumstances.

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With the Grays and Kansas City Monarchs playing a night game under a portable lighting system in Pittsburgh in 1930, the Grays catcher suffered an injury to his hand, according to the book "The Ballplayers." Homestead manager Judy Johnson, who knew of Gibson's reputation as a terrific semipro player, went into the stands looking for the 18-year-old.

"I asked him if he wanted to catch and he said 'yes, sir,' so we had to hold up the game while he went and put on Buck Ewing's uniform," Johnson said. "We signed him the next day."

Gibson played for the Grays the rest of that season and 1931, before jumping to the Crawfords and winning three home-run titles in five seasons. He caught Paige in 1936 to form the most popular battery in African-American history. After starting 1937 in the Dominican Republic, he returned in the summer to play for the Grays.

He won two more home-run titles, in 1938 and 1939, as well as a batting championship in 1938. There are stories that the Senators and Pittsburgh Pirates considered giving the powerful catcher a tryout in the late '30s, but because of the color of his skin he was never granted the opportunity.

In 1940 and 1941, he chose to play south of the border, undoubtedly because of greater financial rewards. After starring for Vera Cruz of the Mexican League, he played in the Puerto Rican Winter League, earning Most Valuable Player honors and a batting title. Gibson was forced to abandon the Mexican League and return to the Grays in 1942 after the team's owner, Cum Posey, hit him with a lawsuit. Gibson led the Negro League in hitting and home runs.

Early the next year, Gibson suffered a brain tumor that put him in a coma. When he awoke, doctors wanted to operate. But Gibson wouldn't let them, fearing that surgery would leave him a vegetable. Despite recurring headaches and a drinking problem, he continued to tear apart the Negro League, winning two more batting crowns and three more home-run titles in the next four seasons.

Although he was mediocre defensively early in his career, he improved through the years. Teammate Cool Papa Bell, who also was voted into the Hall of Fame, said Gibson was a good catcher, had a strong arm and was a good handler of pitchers but had difficulty on pop fouls.

"The Ballplayers" recites this story of the black Babe Ruth's last day: "On Jan. 20, 1947, Gibson told his mother that he was going to die that night. She laughed, but told him to go to bed and that she would call a doctor. With his family gathered around him, Gibson asked for his baseball trophies to be brought to his bedside. He was laughing and talking when he suddenly sat straight up, had a stroke and died."

Now, prove Bonds uses steroids.

[bootless]

Wow, thanks for posting that! (BTW, great home page. First, thank you for your service in the 82nd. Second, if that drawing of the Dark Knight was just a doodle ... wow!)

I know that the stats in the Negro Leagues weren't kept as carefully as in the majors, unfortunately. But how close to 800 do you think he came?

[BluesDuke]

I liked that article. I have heard it said that Gibson improved tremendously as a defencive catcher over the years just by doing it and listening and learning. Roy Campanella once said Josh Gibson was a better handler of pitchers than he got credit for and was also very good at handling the low pitches and saving a lot of wild pitches as he got older.

If only fate had allowed him to play his career maybe five years later than he did begin. It might have been intriguing to see him handling such a staff as the Cleveland Indians of 1948-55; or, the Boston Braves of "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain." From the sound of it, Gibson's skill improvements would have been just right for handling a scroogie specialist like Spahnie or those fat curve balls thrown by people like Mike (The Big Bear) Garcia...

Casey Stengel, exhorting his Yankee hitters in games against the Indians and the St. Louis Browns when Satchel Paige was working as a very effective relief pitcher for them: Get your runs now - Father Time is coming!

Goddammit, maybe there is too many of them - but give me a team of nine of them and let me manage 'em. - Stengel, who admired and liked Paige, when asked once if there were "too many" blacks in the majors in the mid-1950s.

[Mr. Mulliner]

Thanks for posting this. I just bought a book called The Forgotten Players, all about the Negro Leagues. I haven't gotten very far into it yet, but I have already read a fair amount about Josh Gibson. Not to take anything away from him, but the man could not only hit like Ruth, he could probably outdrink him, too.

[Mr. Mulliner]

Need some good, solid information on the looming strike? Hear it from a great American and very knowledgeable baseball fan, George Will:

Baseball's Paradox (George Will)

[BluesDuke]

No disrespect intended to Mr. Will, but as we used to say when trading baseball cards, I will see your George Will and raise you one Allen Barra (his columns appear in both the Wall Street Journal and on Salon.com)...

Bud Selig's Buddies

[Mr. Mulliner]

I just read that article and don't know what to think anymore. Thanks for confusing me on this issue, Duke.

[rdb3]

I know that the stats in the Negro Leagues weren't kept as carefully as in the majors, unfortunately. But how close to 800 do you think he came?

I don't know. Some say right below 800 while others say he hit more than 900. As you pointed out, it's a shame that the stats weren't better kept in the Negro Leagues.

My father pitched for the Cleveland Buckeyes of the Negro Leagues. He told me a lot of stories about Gibson and Paige, although he met Paige but not Gibson. He also knew Larry Doby who was the first black in the American League. Doby played for The Tribe.

Thanks, BTW. My drawing of The Dark Knight was a doodle in class. I darkened and fill it later in the dorm.

[BluesDuke]

I know it isn't easy to comprehend economic issues especially in sports, often as not. I have trouble enough crunching those kinds of numbers - mathematics and I are not normally bosom friends. But if you want a somewhat less confusing if slightly more involving analysis, visit Doug Pappas, who chairs SABR's Business of Baseball Committee. Had I not read his writings on these subjects, I would probably be even more in the dark about these matters. Pappas has a wealth of information and analysis to contribute, and those of us who love the game dearly as you and I love it can only benefit by the experience.

Numbers Reveal Teams Not Nearing Bankruptcy
March Madness: Has Selig Gone Too Far This Time?
It's Time For Bud To Go
DuPuy Disinforms
MLB Vs. Forbes

These should begin giving a far, far more accurate view of just what baseball's picture is or is not...and a far, far more accurate view of just what Bug Selig has done toward smashing the game he claims enough to love.

[bootless]

I don't know. Some say right below 800 while others say he hit more than 900. As you pointed out, it's a shame that the stats weren't better kept in the Negro Leagues.

Wow. I wonder if there's enough material available to produce a movie or documentary. It would be great.

My father pitched for the Cleveland Buckeyes of the Negro Leagues. He told me a lot of stories about Gibson and Paige, although he met Paige but not Gibson. He also knew Larry Doby who was the first black in the American League. Doby played for The Tribe.

Wow again! Do you have these stories on tape? Is rdb2 your father? That was a funky shirt! :-) Seriously, very cool. Thanks, BTW. My drawing of The Dark Knight was a doodle in class. I darkened and fill it later in the dorm.

But still...! I would imagine all the fill-in work would have attracted the professor's attention! It's beautiful. My cousin is a huge Dark Knight fan - I should email your page to him.

Best...

[BluesDuke]

Wow. I wonder if there's enough material available to produce a movie or documentary.

There may well be. I know of a fat-volume encyclopedia of sorts about the Negro Leagues, and a few other books (including the incandescent Only The Ball Was White), which could be used as excellent source material, not to mention the resources of the Hall of Fame Library. A very good movie could probably be made about Josh Gibson, not to mention Satchel Paige (Don't Look Back was a brave enough try but fell somewhat short)...and perhaps Cool Papa Bell.

[rockfish59]

When it was a game!

(1926)

[bootless]

Oh, boy...! You've got the cylinders clicking. I see a trilogy ...40 minutes each. That would indeed be incandescent.

Thanks again for another book recommendation. Do you have a book list on your website? Very, very good columns! (Yes, I peeked!)

Best...

[Dec31,1999]

Oh please. You need to wipe! Go to the bathroom.

[BluesDuke]

I was indeed pondering posting up a recommended reading list on my site. But I think I shall do you the service here and put these titles across. You have already seen Only The Ball Was White, and we are mutual Roger Angell fans. Now, for your reading pleasure, I give you...

Red Smith, Red Smith On Baseball
George F. Will, Bunts
John Thorn, editor, The Armchair Book of Baseball
Jim Brosnan, The Long Season
Thomas Boswell, How Life Imitates The World Series, Why Time Begins On Opening Day, The Heart of the Order, and Cracking The Show
Paul D. Zimmerman and Dick Schaap, The Year The Mets Lost Last Place
A. Bartlett Giamatti, A Great and Glorious Game
George Plimpton, Out of My League
Joe Williams, The Joe Williams Baseball Reader
Ed Linn, Hitter: The Life and Turmoils of Ted Williams
Dan Riley, editor, The Red Sox Reader and The Cubs Reader
Allen Barra, Clearing The Bases: The Greatest Baseball Debates of the Last Century
Bill James, Whatever Happened to the Hall of Fame and The New Bill James Historical Baseball Abstract
Carl Smith, Voices of the Game and Storied Stadiums
Jim Murray, The Best of Jim Murray and The Sporting Life of Jim Murray
Roger Kahn, The Boys of Summer
Robert W. Creamer, Stengel: His Life And Times
Dan Shaughnessy, The Curse of the Bambino and At Fenway: Dispatches from Red Sox Nation
Noel Hynd, The Giants of the Polo Grounds
Arnold Hano, A Day In The Bleachers
Bill Veeck with Ed Linn, Veeck - As In Wreck
Jimmy Breslin, Can't Anybody Here Play This Game? The Hilarious Saga of the Amazin' Mets' First Season
Nicholas Davidoff, editor, Baseball: A Literary Anthology
Eliot Asinof, Eight Men Out
Mark Harris, Bang The Drum Slowly
Bernard Malamud, The Natural
Jim Bouton, Ball Four and I'm Glad You Didn't Take It Personally
Dave Kindred, Glove Stories: The Collected Baseball Writings of Dave Kindred

...just for openers...

[Mikerow]

Hank Greenwald was a heck of a announcer! I grew up listening to him, his knowledge of the history of the game was astounding, much like Bluesduke's

[Mr. Mulliner]

Thanks for those links. I'll check them out.

I know one thing and that is that I don't trust Bud Selig. Putting that guy in charge is where and when I'd expect to find the source of some of these problems.

[Fundamentally Fair]

I dont care how strong players are they are hitting them out on check swings and half swings.

I was at a Braves-Cards game last week. It was 1-1 in the bottom of the 9th and Sheffield drove one out--the pitch was at his shoe laces and he easily stroked it out over left-center. Game over. Exciting, MLB-friendly ending.

[mrustow]

Mazel tov, Mr. Bonds!

[bootless]

Thank you!! I've got about ten of those, but now I have my Christmas list! :-)

Thanks so much...