Remember Ruby Ridge: Ten years later, there are still important lessons.

National Review Online ^ | August 21, 2002 | Timothy Lynch

[gatex]

"...Acting like they are above the rest of us in society...Acting like they make their own rules. "

Please explain the FBI Rules of Engagement at Ruby Ridge -- that have been described by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals as -- unConstitutional --

[gatex]

"You are correct, the same President who gave us the 89 assault weapons ban..."

And resigned from the NRA on public TV.

[Johnny Shear]

Those who resorts to such attacks are admitting that they have lost the argument.

Sorry if you don't like it, but it's what I believe...

I think a lot of people who worship this fool with a death-wish, Randy Weaver are themselves Whacked-Out government hating racist KOOKS who are just LOOKING for a reason to take-on the federal government in some kind of Clint Eastwood "Shoot-Em-Out" dream. Just so they can die and/or be responsible for the deaths of their faimilies and/or followers with what they call "Dignity".

The only problem is that the VAST majority of sane Americans won't play their games and only remember them as the Racist HATERS that they really are!

Don't like that? I don't care....I HATE the fact that you bafoons are in my country and worse yet, represent people like me on message boards like this. You're all the same as any IDIOT who believes and/or follows Cynthia McKinney...You just have differing KOOK ideas.

[dd5339]

If I remember right, it was because Wayne LaPierre had rightly referred to the ATF and FBI at Waco as "Jack Booted Thugs".

Semper Fi!

[Maelstrom]

What's to guess at?

We've both been here for years I know your rhetoric before you post it and you've added nor detracted anything from this argument.

[Maelstrom]

Representative Dingle, not LaPierre.

[Maelstrom]

Who's going to know what happened to you...your extended family...your entire village...

...If some Federal Agency arbitrarily decided to slaughter each and every single one of you?

With the proper amount of propaganda, the of which veracity you've shown is immaterial, you would seemingly support your own slaughter.

[dd5339]

If you don't like living in the same country as us, may I suggest you move. Maybe England or France might be right up your alley.

For those participating in an honest discussion;
Semper Fi!

For those living in La-La land;
Bugger Off!

[gatex]

"...I HATE the fact that you bafoons are in my country and worse yet, represent people like me on message boards like this. You're all the same as any IDIOT who believes and/or follows Cynthia McKinney...You just have differing KOOK ideas."

I thought hate was supposed to be bad.

[dd5339]

Representative John Dingell, the democrat, (but pro gun)??

I stand corrected sir, thank you for pointing that out.

Semper Fi

[gatex]

"...Representative Dingle, not LaPierre."

Rep. Dingle (Democrat) said it first, but then LaPierre, repeated it - in the NRA magazine, I think.

[gatex]

post 81--what about the FBI Rules of Engagement ?

[sinkspur]

What's to guess at?

Well, if you've been here a long time, you know that I haven't written one word on Ruby Ridge or Waco in the four years I've been here.

So you are "guessing" as to what my opinion of both are.

You're free to do that, of course, but you could be wrong.

Nice try at baiting.

[TigersEye]

You have yet to offer anything other than emotional hyperbole to support your opinion. That is the quintessential basis of liberal logic and argument. You have given nothing of substance to refute the facts presented to you. You don't deny them either.

The entire substance of your 'argument' is that people that are 'strange' must comply with government authority no matter how impossible that authority makes it to comply and no matter how many laws the government breaks in dealing with you. In other words if your view of the world isn't in lockstep with what 'society' deems politically correct then you should expect that your civil rights have been suspended and you should do whatever the authorities demand even if they demand that you walk out into their withering gunfire.

After all, you're wierd, so it's your fault the gooberment noticed you. If you're wierd the gooberment has a right to force you to be a spy for them. If you're wierd the gooberment can lie to obtain search warrants and military equipment to arrest you. If you're wierd the gooberment and the media may lie about you and you must accept that without protest.

So far you haven't given any proof that Randy Weaver was or is a racist. I don't think you can conclusively. You are just parroting what the liberal Corporate Media of the Clinton era said he was. So your logic says that it's not important whether you actually are a racist or a kook, if the media says you are then your rights are suspended. Come out with your hands up and don't whine about the gunfire, grenades and CS gas.

I think you're wierd, Johnny.

[Maelstrom]

I don't need you to comment on either.

Your view of the Constitution is support enough, and I thank you for it, for it has helped shaped my understanding of everything that is wrong with government today.

As it turned out for Weaver, the Constitutionality of any of these acts never really comes into play. The government was wrong, it's in the public record, and nobody was prosecuted.

Waco teaches us, with your Constitutional interpretation, that with the correct judiciary, the US government can engage in arbitrary slaughter of select members of it's citizenry sans any violation of law.

You're not safe from it either, buddy.

[Johnny Shear]

You don't deny them either.

No....I simply ignore them. Why? Because I don't believe KOOKS. Not for a SECOND! I don't believe a word any of them say...They've earned their reputation as Propaganda Pushers. Just like Jihad Cynthia McKinney has EARNED her "LOONY" reputation.

It goes back to what my father told me as a child...

"Keep your nose clean and you will be fine. Don't pick any fights and you will be fine. Respect authority and you will be fine. Treat others with respect and you will be fine".

If those IDIOTS, Weaver and Koresh had simply done the above their problems would not have happened in the first place. (But then again, both are/were ticking time-bombs so what happened to them was BOUND to happen sooner or later.

You people sound like whiney little pansy liberals...."It's all the government's fault! WHAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAA! I want to make up my own rules! WHAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAA! Screw society, I am ONLY concerned with myself and what I want to do! WHAAAAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAAA! If anything goes wrong it's because of the big ol' bad government, not because of the choices I have made! WHAAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAA!

Have I said SCREW THAT RACIST KOOK, RANDY WEAVER lately? He's got ONLY himself to blame. No matter HOW MANY of you FREAKS try to defend him.

[dd5339]

Johhny,

Some of us have to stand and fight for what is righteous and struggle against evil wherever evil is found. Sometimes this is defending the defensless, or sometimes this is opposing out of control people, this can be as complex as following Jesus' example of servant leadership, or as brutal as standing at the gate and not letting evil pass.

If not, we would all be condemmed to the life of faceless mediocrity that is yours.

Yes it is a rough road, yes it does set one up as a target for those who would meekly submit to whatever the powers that be want of them, and no it is not a pleasant journey. But in the end, I can hopefully stand up and say, I fought the good fight and made a difference.

Semper Fi

[gatex]

"...I want to make up my own rules! WHAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAA! ...."

Why won't you comment on the un-Constitutional FBI rules of engagement at Ruby Ridge ? --The FBI made up its own un-Constitutional rules of engagement, so why don't you condemn them ?

[gatex]

"Treat others with respect and you will be fine".

" If those IDIOTS, Weaver and Koresh had simply done the above their problems would not have happened in the first place. (But then again, both are/were ticking time-bombs so what happened to them was BOUND to happen sooner or later. You people sound like whiney little pansy liberals...."It's all the government's fault! WHAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAA! I want to make up my own rules! WHAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAA! Screw society, I am ONLY concerned with myself and what I want to do! WHAAAAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAAA! If anything goes wrong it's because of the big ol' bad government, not because of the choices I have made! WHAAAAAAAAAA! WHAAAAAAAAA! "

What does your father think about this ?

[lewislynn]

I don't think though that GH was that involved. The problem stemmed from an out of control alphabet soup orginazation trying to justify their existence.

Yea, I know what you mean, like Clinton and Waco.