Innovation at 350 Knots: New jet could rewrite the rules of commercial air travel.

Nusiness 2.0 ^ | Aug., 30, 2002 | Erick Schonfeld

[Ditto]

I want one of these!

[Ditto]

Faster than a speeding Maglev, Willie. ;~))

[marktwain]

The engines sound like just the ticket for the new UAVs that the military wants!

[AzJP]

Uh, you hit a bullseye. The engine is made by Williams, who also continues to make engines for UAV's and other small weird critters.

[Willie Green]

It helps that Raburn is pals with several billionaires, including Bill Gates, who was the best man at his wedding 16 years ago.

Good grief!
I wonder if this thing will crash as often as MS Windows?

[e_castillo]

http://www.vansaircraft.com/

I'll settle for one of these.

[kylaka]

It is essentially the same engine used in a cruise missle.

[Willie Green]

Related thread: Microsoft: "Our products aren't engineered for security"

[LenS]

It is essentially the same engine used in a cruise missle.

Does this mean that when it crashes it only hits Baby Milk factories and tents with camels?

[StolarStorm]

Thier predictions are absurd. So what if companies start buying these things. Do you really think anyone other then the execs are going to be flying on them? Sure, the one or two jets will be used to ferry the VIPs around, but the sales guys, consultants and other business types will still have to fly the airlines. If an exec needs to go to NY from say Houston, does anyone really think he's going to make a pit stop to let a sales guy off in Cedar Rapids? In order to have full coverage of most traveling employees, corps would have to buy so many of these things that they'd end up being cost prohibitive.

If they go the "sky taxi" or time-sharing (NetJet) route, the per person price would be huge as a lot of infrastructure would be necessary to support the 5-6 passengers per plane.

No, the average business person is going to keep flying on mainlines for a few more decades.

[StolarStorm]

The only companies at risk from this jet are the ones that currently make Business Jets... that's the market segment that needs to be worried.

[Space Wrangler]

Here's a neat little toy as well.

www.rotorway.com

Pretty cool. Your very own chopper at the same price as a luxury SUV. Some day, some day.......

[Joe Bonforte]

I don't think I agree with your analysis. It may be true that the number of airline passengers lured away is fairly small. But those are the most profitable passengers the airlines have.

Taking only four or five percent of the airline's highest paying passengers could prevent the airlines from ever regaining profitability with their current model. If that happens, they'll all follow Eastern, PanAm, USAir, et. al. into oblivion, leaving only the newest, most nimble competitors such as Southwest.

[js1138]

Maybe one more decade. Most of the huge jets have been built for economy of scale. If this thing works, we'll see 10-20 passenger jets hopping between points previously served only by bus. Huge planes are doomed if fear keeps them off the ground.

[jjm2111]

A fortune 500 company might time share one of these babies among its top 5 or top 10 producers.

Maybe some small insurance agency won't, but a company where a top salesman brings in $10 million in revenue a year might have justification.

[Marie Antoinette]

Not absurd. Imagine how much time an employee or executive is spending driving to the airport, waiting in line, packing into the sardine cans, flying from one hub to another hub, driving from the airport to where he is going....

The time wasted is valuable to a company. In a small business jet, these same folks can fly from a much smaller airport closer to where they are to a much smaller airport closer to where they are going. These Eclipse jets are going to cost about the same to take as an airline, but close to half the time wasted. For example, if I want to go somewhere halfway across the country, I have to drive at least two hours to get to the nearest hub. But I live five minutes from IRK that has a big enough runway to handle a business jet. And if my destination is NOT a 'hub' city, I waste more time driving from the hub, I could literally save four hours from a cross country trip. That's more than the actual flight time!

The only problem I see is how long it's going to take to get these air taxi services equipped with Eclipses. And to hire me to fly one!

Mr.M

[dalereed]

It will also take over the small turboprop and a lot of the larger prop business.

I have been watching this for a few years now and would give my eye teeth for one.

The 6 place single that I totaled if purchased new today would be $486k so this plane is going to be well within reach of a large segment of the GA market. A 6-8 place turboprop is well over a million.

[HeadOn]

I dunno. If they do it right, it could be great. For instance, if 5 of my friends and I want to make a 500 mile road trip for a college ball game, we can all pile into the Suburban and chip in $25 apiece for the gas alone, take 7 to 10 hours each way to drive, counting stops, and spend our entire weekend on the road. Counting hotel at, say, $75/night, and on road meals/snacks at maybe $40, that's $140 each for the weekend.

If the operating cost of the air limo is $1/mile, that's $167 each. Even if it's $200 for a ticket, and maybe $250, some will pay if only to save wear and tear of 10-15 hours on the road. AND - I'm home all day Sunday, resting for the work week, and not driving. Not too far-fetched in my opinion.

[StolarStorm]

You're correct about these being the most profitable passengers. No doubt that the big boys will have to change their model a bit to more like SouthWest, but many of them will survive. The pie may be shrinking a bit for the majors, but it looks like capacity is about to decline (U and United). International will also continue to be strong and that is a market segment that Southwest doesn't compete in... and I don't expect these micro-jets to be much of threat there either.

[StolarStorm]

You're correct about these being the most profitable passengers. No doubt that the big boys will have to change their model a bit to be more like SouthWest, but many of them will survive. The pie may be shrinking a bit for the majors, but it looks like capacity is about to decline (U and United). International will also continue to be strong and that is a market segment that Southwest doesn't compete in... and I don't expect these micro-jets to be much of threat there either.