A tax rise of 460% just ain't funny

Philadelphia Daily News ^ | Sep. 26, 2002 | Jill Porter

[buzzyboop]

Imagine: a system of determining property taxes that isn't influenced by who you are, who you know, who your lawyer knows, whether you contributed to somebody's campaign, and what favors you can provide in return.

In Philadelphia!

"People call me up and say, 'Can you fix it?'" ward leader Terry Gillen said about outraged constituents who want their tax bills lowered.

"But I can't fix it," she said. "It's not a corrupt system. It's just a bad system."

Gillen, a former Rendell administration official, is rallying residents at neighborhood meetings for a rebellion against the city's tax board and its policies.

And it was the anguished, frustrated, disgusted complaints of Center City residents who crammed into one of those meetings last week that made me realize: this is anything but funny.

"How many of you have had your taxes double?" state Rep. Babette Josephs asked residents who filled an auditorium at Graduate Hospital.

[buzzyboop]

And Rendell will do this to all of PA if he's elected.

[wattsmag2]

One homeowner said his taxes were $9,000 when he bought his house a few years ago. His property was reassessed this year and he said his new tax bill will be: $31,000.

Ain't no way I'd ever move somewhere with something like that.

[End Times Sentinel]

Actually, this isn't a Rendell issue.  Not to defend him, but as a Philadelphia resident, my taxes stayed more or less the same for all eight years of his administration.

 

That being said this is so typical of the dems and current leader John Street.  Residents like myself who have worked to improve their neighborhoods and properties are responsible for raising housing values.  So Street authorizes a reassesment of everyone's property (although he denies it), and taxes the new value at the same rate.  Thusly a huge increase in city revenues which aren't matched by city requirements.

 

It's not just Center City either.  It's South Philadelphia, the North East, and the River Wards... the same areas that voted for Sam Katz in 99... what a coincidence.

 

At the rate Street is going, there will be a basketball court on every corner of North Philadelphia while the North East seceeds and South Philadelphia is all Section 8.  People do have a choice where they live Big John...

 

 

Owl_Eagle

”Guns Before Butter.”

[2banana]

A tax rise of 460% just ain't funny

Yes it is, to people who have left the socialist cesspool of Philadelphia.

[End Times Sentinel]

One homeowner said his taxes were $9,000 when he bought his house a few years ago. His property was reassessed this year and he said his new tax bill will be: $31,000.

Ain't no way I'd ever move somewhere with something like that.

Not to mitigate the issue, but that factors out to $2583.33 a month.  This "homeowner" is either wrong or lying... or both.

Owl_Eagle

”Guns Before Butter.”

[NativeNewYorker]

Townhouses in the East Side of Manhattan, arguably the costliest/sq ft residential area in the nation, pay those kinds of taxes.

For a bunghole like Philly to demand those sums is literally insane.

[NativeNewYorker]

I've seen townhouses in NYC with $45,000/yr tax bills.

The property tax on APARTMENTS in nice areas often exceeds $10,000/year here.

[noexcuses]

Not to mitigate the issue, but that factors out to $2583.33 a month.  This "homeowner" is either wrong or lying... or both.

I agree, $2583.33 per month doesn't sound right. Maybe he's confusing his assessment value with the actual tax.

[End Times Sentinel]

The property tax on APARTMENTS in nice areas often exceeds $10,000/year here.

That was one of the secrets of Philadelphia.  Until recently, a home that would have sold for around $180-200 K in D.C. or $300 K in Boston could be had for $75-$80 K in Philadelphia.  With the explosion in the real estate market over the past couple of years, prices have roughly doubled, but there still way below what I hear from other markets.

However, compared to Philadelphia, the New York prices are other worldly.

Owl_Eagle

”Guns Before Butter.”

[buzzyboop]

Not to defend (Rendell), but as a Philadelphia resident, my taxes stayed more or less the same for all eight years of his administration.

How many times have I seen books cooked, and everything looks hunky-dory, until the man in charge moves on, and his successor is left to pick up the pieces?? See BillyJeff for another example..

[NativeNewYorker]

It's not at all unusual now for professionals to live in Philly and commute to NY, trading train time for property price savings.

If Philly's govt had played its cards right, the town could've become an alternative business center or back office locale for NYC. Instead, now, it's just a dreary 15 minutes between Princeton and Wilmington.

[Poohbah]

Not to mitigate the issue, but that factors out to $2583.33 a month. This "homeowner" is either wrong or lying... or both.

9K a year seems outrageous, too. But if the property was reassesed, and it had gone up that much in price, and the base was 9K, then 31K sounds about right.

In California, the assessment is based on how much you actually spent buying the house.

[11B3]

I've got a couple of questions to ask you , since you reside there yourself: It sounds as though many of these properties were purchased when they were run down, or in less than desireable neighborhoods. Along with that I'm assuming that their purchase price would be 'cheap' in comparison to what they are worth today.

So who is it that wants to foreclose on your homes? It sounds as though it is someone who has the power to assess the value of these properties arbitrarily - in order to tax you out of there. After all, if the taxes are so damn high, who in their right mind would buy them? Whoever is behind the tax scheme. Once they get you out, they will lower the taxes, which will reinflate the prices again to the level that you were originally assured it was worth.

My other question is how many of you in this situation hold the 'Real Estate Deed' to your properties? (I mean own them free and clear without mortgages?) If you do - which means you only owe real estate taxes annually - then why don't you patent your properties? Once you do that, the fine folks at city hall there in Philly can take a giant handful of sand and pound away all they want. They can't tax you (or foreclose, or even enter for ANY reason) once you patent the land. If you would like a link or two about this, let me know.

[Jason_b]

Absolutely want the link! Has it been done? Or is it some thing paranoids dream about and some actually try only to find their property being auctioned for back taxes on the courthouse steps?

thanks...

[Zon]

You don't own "your" house. If you don't believe that, don't pay the forced barrel-of-a gun property tax for a year or two and see who really owns the property you thought was yours.

[wattsmag2]

According to Yahoo, HERE, the property tax rate for Philly is 2.5% per year. A million dollar home would be up there.

[blackdog]

This seems really dangerous to the city budget in the long run. I had a real tax issue after buying our farm. Being the new owners, we had our tax bill go up every year by about 20%. I went to the open books meeting and found that we had been selectively targeted because the town board wanted to clobber us and spare the long term farmers who had not seen a tax increase in 15 years. We got an attorney, and on the basis of similar property assessments of other farmers being valued far lower than us, the town had to give us our money back and were also butt whipped by the judge. The attorney's fees were paid by the town as well.

If Street is not careful, residents will take their case to the courts. Philly courts are of course corrupt, but on appeal it will go to the state, and out of the city's control. The bill for the city could spiral out of control.

[Poohbah]

The claim that a self-awarded "land patent" somehow prevents foreclosure for property taxes is specious, and has been shot down repeatedly.

[blackdog]

Maintaining a typical patent is expensive. What exactly is the theory in a land patent?

[Poohbah]

Basically, the theory is that the land patent grants permanent ownership to the person the patent is given, or the heirs, assigns, or subsequent purchasers of the land in question.

Relevant cases include Nixon v. Phillipoff (ND IL 1985) 615 F.Supp 890 aff'd 787 F2d 596(t) and Hilgeford v. Peoples Bank (ND Ind 1985) 607 F.Supp 536 aff'd (7th Cir 1985).