Evolution Coverage Missed Real Story

FoxNews. com ^ | September 30, 2002 | John G. West, Jr.

[Taliesan]

My point is that thee are many areas of human understanding that fall outside the realm of science. Science is only one way of building understanding. It is systematic and cold in its ways. I do not demean theological study when I say it is not science, because the nature of theology is not scientific, nor is science theological. But that does not mean that either are diminished in the realm of human understanding. They are different tools that let us understand different things.

That's pretty fair, actually. You might want to just work with that.

[cornelis]

scientific understanding is a subset of understanding

Yes, and as a subset, it requires justification under its larger rubric. If it is a subset, it is subordinate. In other words, this strict definition of science belongs to a world larger than itself.

[r9etb]

Why is nonexistence of God a fundamental assumption?

How could it not be the fundamental assumption of atheism?

[Pietro]

"If it weren't for the fact that evolution disagrees with the Biblical account of creation, none of this would be under discussion."

Actually, I believe the issue is larger than that. As a Bible believing Christian I don't see evolution as a threat at all, especially since evolution has nothing to say about the origin of life itself.

I think that new scientific models, not limited to ID, but including Wolfram's algorithms may perhaps prove more useful in describing natural phenomenom than evolution. Nor is anyone suggesting that evolution not be taught, or conversly that Creationism replace it.

[Taliesan]

In other words, this strict definition of science belongs to a world larger than itself.

Which world, by implication, contains entities not fully accessed by the scientific method.

Or maybe the scientific method is the only legitimate mode of knowledge.

[scripter]

How does an explicit statement denying any intent "to promote or require the teaching of creationism" get translated by the newsmedia into an effort to teach creationism?

Excellent question.

[Lev]

How could it not be the fundamental assumption of atheism?

I was referring to atheists, not atheism. Of all the assumptions a person who happens to be an atheist can have nonexistence of God is not the most funcamental IMO. Btw, we can go into whether atheism HAS an assumption that God doesn't exist:

Robert Flint (a theologian): In his 1885 book Anti-Theistic Theories, he noted that

The atheist is not necessarily a man who says there is no God. What is called positive or dogmatic atheism, so far from being the only kind of atheism, is the rarest of all kinds. ...every man is an atheist who does not believe that there is a God, although his want of belief may not be rested on any allegation of positive knowledge that there is no God, but simply on one of want of knowledge that there is a God.

From about.com

[VOA]

bump

[f.Christian]

Posted by f.Christian to Condorman
On News/Activism Sep 27 4:44 PM #94 of 650

To: f.Christian

Have you heard the story going around about the bio prof in a well-known NorthEast university who is speaking about evolution and notices three guys snickering in the back of the room? "You guys must be fundamentalist Christians" snorts the professor. One of the three replies "No, we're math majors; like, we understand the laws of probability..."



17 posted on 9/27/02 11:07 AM Pacific by piltdownpig

[f.Christian]

To: Dimensio
As I see it, evolution is an ideological doctrine. If it were only a "scientific theory", it would have died a natural death 50 - 70 years ago; the evidence against it is too overwhelming and has been all along. The people defending it are doing so because they do not like the alternatives to an atheistic basis for science and do not like the logical implications of abandoning their atheistic paradigm and, in conducting themselves that way, they have achieved a degree of immunity to what most people call logic.

488 posted on 7/29/02 5:18 AM Pacific by medved

Main Entry: log·ic

Pronunciation: 'lä-jik
Function: noun

Etymology: Middle English logik, from Middle French logique, from Latin logica, from Greek logikE, from feminine of logikos of reason, from logos reason -- more at LEGEND

Date: 12th century

1 a

(1) : a science that deals with the principles and criteria of validity of inference and demonstration : the science of the formal principles of reasoning

(2) : a branch or variety of logic

(3) : a branch of semiotic; especially : SYNTACTICS

(4) : the formal principles of a branch of knowledge

b (1) : a particular mode of reasoning viewed as valid or faulty

(2) : RELEVANCE, PROPRIETY

c : interrelation or sequence of facts or events when seen as inevitable or predictable

d : the arrangement of circuit elements (as in a computer) needed for computation; also : the circuits themselves

2 : something that forces a decision apart from or in opposition to reason < the logic of war >

- lo·gi·cian /lO-'ji-sh&n/ noun

[f.Christian]

Creation/God...REFORMATION(Judeo-Christianity)---secular-govt.-humanism/SCIENCE---CIVILIZATION!

Originally the word liberal meant social conservatives(no govt religion--none) who advocated growth and progress---mostly technological(knowledge being absolute/unchanging)based on law--reality... UNDER GOD---the nature of GOD/man/govt. does not change. These were the Classical liberals...founding fathers-PRINCIPLES---stable/SANE scientific reality/society---industrial progress...moral/social character-values(private/personal) GROWTH(limited NON-intrusive PC Govt/religion---schools)!

Evolution...Atheism-dehumanism---TYRANNY(pc-religion/rhetoric)...

Then came the SPLIT SCHIZOPHRENIA/ZOMBIE/BRAVE-NWO1984 LIBERAL NEO-America---the post-modern age

[The Man]

Any science has to operate under the assumption that to a greater or lesser degree, data is true. Otherwise, it can't go anywhere.

[f.Christian]

To: f.Christian

Now I follow, thank you. Actually, I don't disagree with this at all since I see the left as abandoning the uncertianty of democracy and majority rule for the assurance technocracy and expert rule.


152 posted on 9/10/02 12:17 PM Pacific by Liberal Classic

[Lev]

"You guys must be fundamentalist Christians" snorts the professor. One of the three replies "No, we're math majors; like, we understand the laws of probability..."

Unfortunately, they, like, you know, don't apply those laws appropriately, you know?

[f.Christian]

D. Axelrod, Science 128:7-

"One of the major unsolved problems of geology and evolution is the occurrence of diversified, multi-cellular marine invertebrates in Lower Cambrian rocks on all the continents and their absence in rocks of greater age."

"their absence in rocks of 'greater' age."

The 'greater' age in layers exists if you think the layers formed from the top!

At one pt. the whole of the Earth was hot cooling from the surface in successive layers from below---outward!

Nothing missing in those layers---no mystery!

These invertebrates can only exist above ground level...in water/air---not underground!

[f.Christian]

Geologic columns/dating...what about the massive canyon on mars---no water/erosion!
The size---circumference of the Earth has gotten smaller(although at certain pts. it could have been changing/variable).

During initial collapse(center heating/condensing) large ridges---mountains(large rocky...vast/fast soil erosion) would protrude upwards!

Land wouldn't form evenly...continents would remain at higher levels above water level then plates would dry out(releasing water/moisture/rain)---shrink producing cracks/fissures---then layered-canyons/basins/ravines...via cooled and hot sediments would form(rise/uplift) as the shrink/sink-ing would continue...producing more mountains/hills(slight-no erosion)--'volcanoes' continously---to fill the receding excessive gaps/holes!

At the Grand Canyon older sedimentary levels are at the top and the fresher/newer ones below...those straight up 'buttes' came out of hole--soft spots in the plates like cake decorations---Ayre's Rock like a bubble in a blown tire.

All that erosion/sedimentary crap old age of the Earth is hooie-dooie!

There is not enough dust on the moon to support an old earth dating system!

[f.Christian]

Geologic column---dating??

From the evolution textbook...

Why does it look like it does(grand canyon)?

"The reason that it looks the way does is due to the sequence in which the events that help to create it happened. We already know that there was once a very tall chain of mountains in the area that occupied the Grand Canyon. These mountains were, over many millions of years, eventually eroded away to form a level plain. Fluctuations in climate then caused the oceans to move in over successive periods and each time a new rock layer was deposited. The rock layers were deposited one on top of the other and sometimes there were long periods in between in which some of the upper layers were eroded away, sometimes completely."

"We already know that there was once a very tall chain of mountains in the area that occupied the Grand Canyon. These mountains were, over many millions of years, eventually eroded away to form a level plain.

That is called science..."we already know"!

Campfire stories! Junk!!

Evolution...tall tales/legends---big lies(no comprehension)!

But the effect is permanent---zombie brains---religion/ideology---BIAS!

Govt school religion---'science'!

Bias means off the wall/page---outta reality...desire for something not true!

Evo cargo-go cult---ufo's!

[ThinkPlease]

D. Axelrod, Science 128:7-

Note that Science 128 came out July 4th, 1958. I mean, really now. Can't you come up with anything more recent?

[f.Christian]

The layering of the rocks hasn't changed much in thousands of years...so what!

[f.Christian]

Originally the word liberal meant social conservatives who advocated growth and progress---mostly technological(knowledge being absolute/unchanging)based on law--reality--UNDER GOD...the nature of GOD/man/govt. does not change. These were the Classical liberals...founding fathers-PRINCIPLES---stable/SANE scientific reality/society---industrial progress...moral/social character-values GROWTH!

Then came the post-modern age of switch-flip-spin-DEFORMITY-cancer...Atheist secular materialists through ATHEISM/evolution CHANGED-REMOVED the foundations...demolished the wall(separation of state/religion)--trampled the TRUTH-GOD...built a satanic temple over them---made these absolutes subordinate--relative and calling all the residuals---technology/science === evolution to substantiate/justify their efforts--claims...social engineering--PC--atheism...anti-God/Truth RELIGION--DECLARED a crusade/WAR--JIHADof INTOLERANCE/TYRANNY against God--man--society!!

Liberals/Evolution BELIEVE they are the conservatives--guardians too...

the shield between state and religion(evolution/atheism) is gone---this is... chernobyl---radiation poisoning...NUCLEAR SOCIAL ANTARTICA---Alien-AMERICA!!

Hypnotism--witchcraft ideology--politics--religion--BRAINWASHING--superstition--BIAS---EVOLUTION/ATHEISM is a Hate CRIME

ps...Atheism/evolutionism is the essence of liberalism/socialism---State secular MONOPOLY religion forbidding the freedom of speech/religion of everything except atheism!

We need a new civil rights law---revolution!