The Catholic Vote

EWTN ^ | Various dates, Election 2002 | EWTN, various

[B-Chan]

You know well the joke about those doing time in hell because they ate a hot dog on Friday prior to Vatican II.

No one goes to Hell for simply eating a hot dog on Friday. They go to Hell for the sin of Pride, the pride of a person who freely chooses to disobey the teaching of the Church in a matter of faith and/or morals.

God, being perfect, is perfectly Just. He doesn't throw anybody in Hell; Hell is the final destination of those who freely choose to put their own wishes and desires above God's. The only people who go to Hell are people who want to go there.

[Aristophanes]

most human beings are dumber than bags of rocks and therefore have no business participating in the affairs of government. This is why the Church has to lay out a series of strict guidelines like these -- if left to their own devices, people will often support a morally bankrupt form of government over a morally legitimate one.

Reminds me of something the late Rich Mullins said one time:

"Democracy isn't bad politics, it's just bad math. A thousand corrupt minds are just as evil as one corrupt mind."

I miss him.

[redhead]

Wow, Patent! Thanks for this!

[rogerthedodger]

I'm not sure what we are debating anymore--maybe you can clarify for me. While I do not believe that Jesus was contemptous of Pilate's authority as a civil ruler, I do believe Jesus felt and knew that Pilate had no spiritual authority over Him, that whatever Pilate did, he was doing it becaue it is what God wanted, and that whatever Pilate said or did to Him, it didn't really matter because He was destined to die anyhow and nothing Pilate could or couldn't do was going to impinge on the message that was to emanate from His life and death.

My analogy may not have been correctly presented. I would reword it this way: I think Jesus graciously abided by the laws of man during His time on earth. Thus, in the analogy, He would be the parent of the scout who both 1) willingly submits to the edicts of the scouts' board, but 2) at the same time, feels as if the power and order of the scouts' board of inquiry was essentially meaningless in His day to day mission or message.

[FormerLib]

A requested Orthodox ping.

[sinkspur]

No one goes to Hell for simply eating a hot dog on Friday. They go to Hell for the sin of Pride, the pride of a person who freely chooses to disobey the teaching of the Church in a matter of faith and/or morals.

It was a joke, for heaven's sake. I'm not sure where abstaining from meat falls, since it is a discipline of the Church that's flexible.

The only people who go to Hell are people who want to go there.

Well, we can hope that Hell's population is very small, then.

[RightWingMama]

Thanks for the ping. Save for a later read.

[B-Chan]

It was a joke, for heaven's sake. I'm not sure where abstaining from meat falls, since it is a discipline of the Church that's flexible.

Well, okay. You're off the hook -- but only because we're from the same Diocese. Speaking of: come visit us at St. Mary the Virgin parish sometime. Ever been to an Anglican Use mass?

Well, we can hope that Hell's population is very small, then.

We do. But that's the truly wonderful part about Christianity: the only way to end up in Hell is to look into Christ's loving eyes, fully realizing one's own sin and His perfect Sacrifice that forgives it, and say to Him, "Non serviam. I'd rather reign in Hell than serve You in Heaven."

We should all pray to God that nobody chooses to go to Hell.

[Salvation]

Votes in for Oregon

Voted for Mannix, a Catholic for governor.

Also Keller, a Catholic at my parish, for County treasurer.

Could not vote for these Catholics in a neighboring precinct:

Walsh for City Council-Keizer
Lee for Mayor of Keizer

Both Catholics!

[Conservative til I die]

In reading a very good, concise history of the Church (a pro-Catholic history, not the usual anti-Catholic fantasy) and I was surprised at how the Church favored the monarchy over the reformist/liberal governments that sprung up in the 1800s. THe author seemed very pro-monarchy as well, with the Church being the giver of power by way of God.

[EODGUY]

Thank you, Patent. Article read and bookmarked.

God Bless,

EODGUY

[Antoninus]

A mortal sin not to vote? An eternity in hell because one didn't go to the polls?

Tell me, sinky, would a German Catholic who voted for the Nazis in 1934, knowing full-well their rabidly anti-semitic platform, have committed a mortal sin?

[reloader]

Homer; Right Above "A Brief Catachism for Catholic Voters", and Above the "Navigation" heading of this thread, you will find the link to bookmark this thread.
Try Edit-Find-Bookmark, and you will find it.C

[Alberta's Child]

I think Jesus graciously abided by the laws of man during His time on earth.

I think that's a good way to put it. St. Thomas Aquinas postulated that Christ did not come to earth simply to redeem mankind. His rationale was that an all-powerful God could have redeemed mankined simply by willing it -- so there must have been another reason for Christ to become man and spend 33 years on earth. St. Thomas' theory was that Christ's mission involved not just the redemption of the human race, but was aimed at providing a perfect example of the human virtues for all of us to follow.

In that regard, I'd say it would have been pointless for Christ to assume a human nature only to go around making it clear that human rules did not apply to him.

[Alberta's Child]

We would also do well to prepare ourselves for the inevitable result of what this modern world has become. After all, "the rain falls on the just and the unjust."

[Alberta's Child]

I was surprised at how the Church favored the monarchy over the reformist/liberal governments that sprung up in the 1800s. The author seemed very pro-monarchy as well, with the Church being the giver of power by way of God.

You have to remember that there was a very good practical reason for the Church to favor a monarchy. The Church fathers knew that most people are not capable of understanding Christianity, so there was always a feeling that it would be much easier to convert a royal family than an entire nation. If the king was a true Christian, then most of his subjects would become Christians because they were not capable of having original thoughts of their own.

[ppaul]

BUMP

[nickcarraway]

BUMP

[Aquinasfan]

I've always found the conversations between Christ and Pontius Pilate to be the most fascinating parts of the New Testament.

"What is truth?" You could write volumes on that line alone.