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To: Justa
I'll bet you've never set foot on a new modern hi-tech machine shop. The technology would blow you away. Not everyone out there can afford an ivy league degree. Not everyone out there has the desire to work in a cubicle and make a tall stack of paper shorter at the end of the day.

What about the tens of thousands of kids who graduate from H.S. each year and maybe are not that skilled to get a "hi-tech" job or a job in telecommunications.

I know of several young guys that prefer "working with their hands" and like to see something in the physical realm for their 8 hours work at the end of the day. Since 9 out of 10 mom and pop machine shops and tool making shops have been put out of business in the NE in the last 15 years, these kids have no secure jobs to step into. The few tool making jobs that are around pay VERY good, good enough for mommy to stay home with the kids if she so chooses.

Yea "we're not a manufacturing based economy any more"
No sh!t....thanks to ""free trade".

Free trade hs a very high price.

My friends in the few remaining tool shops are pulling down 70,000 or more a year.....not bad for working in a quiet, well lit, air conditioned shopas well as not having a degree.

One problem with your statement is this: What exactly have we transitioned to? Ask the .commers how secure their jobs are. They're all working three Mcjobs now to survive. It really sucks NOT having a manufacturing base to fall back on.

Don't take this personally, but you're statements are not based on reality.
32 posted on 11/05/2002 5:25:49 AM PST by taxed2death
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To: taxed2death
Sorry about my miss-spells today, I suffered a horrendous accident here in my own sweatshop. (NOT!) I cut two fingers yesterday and have them bandaged, makes for some funky typing :) :)
38 posted on 11/05/2002 5:44:43 AM PST by taxed2death
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To: taxed2death
"I'll bet you've never set foot on a new modern hi-tech machine shop. The technology would blow you away."

Probably. Lots of robotics I'd assume.

"Not everyone out there can afford an ivy league degree."

Myself included.

"Not everyone out there has the desire to work in a cubicle and make a tall stack of paper shorter at the end of the day."

I sense a problem in your reasoning. How bad can it be if people are basing their employment decisions on what they "desire" to do? Sounds like a dreamworld to me. Adapt and make the best of it. Repeat. Never stop working on the future and always pray for good health. Imo, that's the Good Life, not the crap they spamm via the media about disposable income and leisure. If I had enemies....

"What about the tens of thousands of kids who graduate from H.S. each year and maybe are not that skilled to get a "hi-tech" job or a job in telecommunications."

Easy answer: Join the military. If they're intelligent and non-psychotic they'll have their pick of career opportunities. They'll be tested on the way in for their aptitudes and the skills they acquire will guide them throughout their military career. Should they be injured while in service their health, skills, knowledge and aptitudes will be reevaluated and they'll receive Vocational Rehabilitation. That's my story.

" I know of several young guys that prefer "working with their hands" and like to see something in the physical realm for their 8 hours work at the end of the day.

See above! -although special terms and conditions apply.

" Since 9 out of 10 mom and pop machine shops and tool making shops have been put out of business in the NE in the last 15 years, these kids have no secure jobs to step into."

You mean no secure manufacturing job. BFD, sounds like a pipe dream anyways. Like getting paid 70K to pick cotton or work in a textile mill. Reality is always different. Don't be cruel and torture the young ones with BS expectations or promises.

"The few tool making jobs that are around pay VERY good, good enough for mommy to stay home with the kids if she so chooses.

Sounds like a long-term contract, i.e., for the government. I wouldn't count those jobs as being 'secure' much longer. You can't base reality for the young folks on some leftover plumb job from a outdated economic model. That's the stuff heartaches are made of.

"My friends in the few remaining tool shops are pulling down 70,000 or more a year.....not bad for working in a quiet, well lit, air conditioned shopas well as not having a degree."

You said it: "not bad". True, not bad at all -because it's extraordinary! And I'd bet the reason the company can pay that much is because no one else can do what they do with their hi-tech machine equipment. I.e., innovation. They'll have to stay on the cutting-edge too or else their products and the wages become impractical. The workers will then suffer pay cuts, lose their jobs and the company will go out of businesss. I'm sure you're familiar with that.

"One problem with your statement is this: What exactly have we transitioned to?

Good question. I think we're still transitioning and it's an information and global financial management economy.

"Ask the .commers how secure their jobs are. They're all working three Mcjobs now to survive.

Not really. If they're doing that they're probably retraining at the same time. If they're not retraining they were never suited for IT in the first place. I spent 18 months studying and taking certifications before getting my current job. As I'm now getting up to speed in this job I'm prepping for the next one.

"It really sucks NOT having a manufacturing base to fall back on."

True. There's a base, it's just not that big and very dynamic. It also sucks not having an agricultural base to fall back on. Like a 100 years ago how children would go pick crops several months out of the year instead of attending school so they could help their family eat. Wooo hoooo, those were the days.... And it all went to hell with those darn machines.

"Don't take this personally, but you're statements are not based on reality."

Actually, they're based upon my own life. If it seems "unreal" to you well yeah, because: "Wooo hooo these are the days!

42 posted on 11/05/2002 7:26:01 AM PST by Justa
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