One thousand US troops arrive in Israel

The link you provided only sends me to the J-Post subscription page, so you'll have to be more clear if I'm to answer your question. Your post #19 seems clear -- you claim the IDF tortures Palestinians (although you make no distinction between Palestinian terrorists and your average Ahmed). Your post (#60) is not nearly so clear. Please explain.

HERE'S the article. (consider registering at JP. It's free. and you gain full access) . . . .

Israeli border police operating in the West Bank city of Hebron have forced Palestinians they detained to choose whether to have a nose, arm or leg broken in a sort of "lottery," Palestinians said Sunday.

The police investigative unit of the Israeli Justice Ministry is reviewing the complaints and may open an investigation, said ministry spokesman Jacob Galanti.

Israel's army spokesman said it did not know of specific cases of such beatings but was looking into the charges.

While Palestinians often accuse Israeli security forces of beating them, Palestinian doctors and security officials in Hebron said such incidents increased after an attack on Nov. 11 in which Palestinian militants ambushed Israeli security forces, killing 12. Palestinians said they were often beaten when they were caught violating an Israeli curfew.

A day after the fatal attack, along a path used by Jewish settlers to walk into Hebron, Israeli troops moved into the Palestinian-controlled section of the city and imposed the curfew throughout the city.

In one recent case, a Palestinian was caught during a curfew walking home from a relative's house.

"When they stopped us they were really angry and you could see the fire in their eyes and they were tough," Rujdi al-Jamal told The Associated Press.

The border policemen forced the Palestinians to choose hich part of their bodies they wanted broken; the nose, an arm or a leg, Jamal said. Or they could choose to be shot, the policemen allegedly said.

"There was no way to choose which is the most important for you," Jamal said.

Jamal choose his hand, and the policemen then broke it with a rifle butt, he said.

Another Palestinian told the Israeli newspaper Yediot Ahronot that border policemen detained him and four friends and took them to a Jewish settlement in the city. The security forces prepared pieces of paper for what they called a "lottery" to decide which parts of the Palestinians' bodies would be broken, or the detainees could decide themselves, the unnamed Palestinian told the daily.

"I chose the nose because nothing hurts as much as a broken arm or broken leg," the student of Islamic studies told the paper.

Another Palestinian, who also did not want to give his name, told the newspaper that border police who stopped him while he was traveling in his car said he could choose between a broken arm or a broken car. He said he choose his arm, thinking the forces would not follow through on the threat since it's harder to break an arm than damage a car.

But the border policemen then broke his arm, he said.

Palestinians who allege they were beaten will meet with officials from the police investigative unit on Monday, the paper reported.

The army spokesman said in reaction to the reports that it had not found any truth to the charges in an initial investigation of cases in the Yediot report, but the army would continue to look into the accusations.

Thanks for the article, but it doesn't clear up what you wrote in post #60.

If the story above is true, and the IDF is indeed torturing innocent Palestinians, then I agree with you that Israel's security isn't enhanced by such behavior. (I advocate torturing only known terrorists). But what exactly does this have to do with the 1000 or so Americans going over there to help Israel with their ABM (Patriot and Arrow) force?

The initial train of thought began when Thinking Gal posted this picture . . .

I observed that COMMON VALUES are not absolute, and I quibbled that certain IDF practices are difficult to defend. . . at least I hope that our boys would not adopt such methods. My hope (perhaps futile) is that the "situation" does not evolve to the point that such practices are routine and necessary.

I see now.

I of course share your hope. But the American servicemen stationed over there will not be saddled with the same duties as IDF border patrolmen, so your fear is unjustified. Their job will be manning those ABM batteries, and little else.

I'd also suggest that you to take Palestinian accusations with a grain of salt. Sure, some are true. But many (more) are not.