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U.S. Gets Warning From North Korea
New York Times ^
| Wednesday, December 25, 2002
| By HOWARD W. FRENCH
Posted on 12/25/2002 8:19:45 AM PST by JohnHuang2
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To: JohnHuang2
We get signal.
Someone set us up the bomb.
21
posted on
12/25/2002 10:56:58 AM PST
by
boris
To: McGavin999
Assassination of Kim Jong il through co-opting of remote family members who have been screwed over, or dispondent elements of the Korean People's Army, with Western covert support, may be the best first start as opposed to an all out assault at this time. Regime change through destablilization, a coup de etat with promises of Western aid to the ringleaders, or the establishment of UNHCR refugee camps along the Chinese border followed by a US propaganda leaflet and pirate broadcast campaign, all might work at this time. We would need some support for the plan from S. Korean and Japan. It might only be a start, but something clearly has to be done within the next 12 months IMHO.
To: AmericanInTokyo
My version of the US response to NK....."Duck" then a brilliant flash of light and a perfectly shaped mushroom cloud directly over their nuke facility.
To: JohnHuang2
To: AmericanInTokyo
I think that's a well thought out and workable plan. The big problem is the recent anti-Americanism in both South Korea and somewhat less in Japan.
To: JohnHuang2
It's definitely time to rethink the Korean policy. Sitting on the DMZ doesn't look so smart when the other side has a couple (and probably soon to be half dozen) nukes that can blow holes through the DMZ.
Fact is, if they nuked the DMZ and the capital of South Korea, what the heck would we do? Kinda hard to nuke back anything of value in North Korea. Plus their whole army would be in South Korea by the time we decided how to respond - so we wouldn't be able to nuke anything of military value in North Korea by then.
Maybe under the circumstance we should treat them like Pakistan. The South Koreans have kind of been jerks toward us recently anyway, so who the heck are we protecting? Maybe we should just move our current DMZ troops out of the Korean DMZ and park them on the Southern border of the US. That would stop our illegal immigration problem!
To: Dog Gone
Agreed. Not only is the NK leadership loco but they will sell this technology to anyone with cash. It is an incredibly serious problem. NK would readily sell nuclear bombs and missiles to anyone with the ability to pay hard currency. Another gift from Clintonius Caligu Maximus.
Barring sudden sanity taking over the NK leadership and the fact that an embargo could not be leakproof. I am afraid military action is the only realistic option. Hopefully we can take out the nuke plants without NK trying to nuke Seoul or our 30K troops in the DMZ and SK.
27
posted on
12/25/2002 1:07:00 PM PST
by
Maynerd
To: JohnHuang2
SEOUL, South Korea, Dec. 24. North Korea warned today of an "uncontrollable catastrophe" unless the United States agrees to a negotiated solution to a tense standoff over its nuclear energy and weapons programs.
Two words...
"Neutron F***in' Bomb"! (nod to Dennis Leary).
No more pussy-footin with these cheap dictators! If it brings on calamity, then it does so.
These dictators have been building towards this day for FAR too long, and we have had too many Socialist/Liberals running the State Department and hand-wringing over "US Imperialism".
No longer. The Giant has been awakened, and heaven help the ones who awakened it, because WE won't!
Remember...
"The Avalanche has already started. It is too late for the PEBBLES to vote!"
28
posted on
12/25/2002 1:40:02 PM PST
by
Itzlzha
To: Maynerd
Hopefully we can take out the nuke plants without NK trying to nuke Seoul or our 30K troops in the DMZ and SK. I don't know if that is a good assumption or not. The whole South Korean situation really complicates matters for us. We really can't do anything militarily against NK without getting approval from South Korea. It is their country which is most vulnerable to NK retaliation, of course. And given their pacifist tendencies, it seems unlikely that they would approve of military action.
We could do it unilaterally, but do we really want to gamble the lives of all the citizens in Seoul? There is at least some possibility of destroying South Korea in an effort to protect it.
We might simply choose to do nothing. After all, NK is not an imminent threat to the US. Their missile program is advanced, but it's not ICBM quality, and we will have deployed missile defense before they deploy ICBMs.
But that leaves open the risks we've already discussed.
The only feasible military operation that would minimize risk to South Korea is an overwhelming surprise attack by us, probably using nuclear weapons to obliterate these weapon sites and nuclear facilities. We'd also have to decapitate NK leadership, essentially destroying the country in a few minutes.
We have the firepower to do it, but I don't know if we're prepared to accept the geopolitical consequences of that. I suspect we aren't.
29
posted on
12/25/2002 1:45:23 PM PST
by
Dog Gone
To: Dog Gone
"We don't have a lot of good or easy options"
No, we don't. But we do know what these options are and we should do what is necessary to eliminate any future threats to us or our allies.
To: Cannoneer No. 4
"When I was in Korea back 20 years ago Korean antipathy for Japan was understood, but muted. Have Korean-Japanese relations deteriorated significantly in the last several years? "
This isn't the case anymore. The Yen is pretty strong with the Won and most Korean cities cater more the the Japanese then any other people. They speak good Japanese and know the power of money. The younger generation doesn't have the distrust of the Japanese that the older generations do.
To: JohnHuang2
'Warning?' The Old Gray Whore strikes again. In my day we called that a threat.
To: JohnHuang2
Sorta like getting a warning from Paul Reubens.
To: JohnHuang2
The North Korean defense minister, Kim Il Chol, went further, warning of "merciless punishment" to the United States if it pursued a confrontational approach to the emerging nuclear crisis.
Who do these people think they are? Their little no-dong (aptly named) missles won't even reach the continental United States.
I say we take "merciless punishment" for $200
34
posted on
12/25/2002 5:12:28 PM PST
by
Jhoffa_
To: Dog Gone
We really can't do anything militarily against NK without getting approval from South Korea.
I would think all bet's are off when those putz's start threatening to "blow up the earth"
Sure, they can destroy their neighbors.. But someone needs to remind them that once they let this genie out of the bottle, and the damage is either imminent or already done, there's nothing that will save them. And I wonder what Pootie-poot's going to do about this? After all, they are in his backyard.
35
posted on
12/25/2002 5:18:18 PM PST
by
Jhoffa_
To: JohnHuang2
The fact that the ChiComs seem to be in favor of nonproliferation bodes well for a peaceful settlement.
Without China's support, North Korea is basically isolated in the international community.
To: Dog Gone
"The only feasible military operation that would minimize risk to South Korea is an overwhelming surprise attack by us, probably using nuclear weapons to obliterate these weapon sites and nuclear facilities. We'd also have to decapitate NK leadership, essentially destroying the country in a few minutes. "
Given political realities in the US, as well as the real threat of tremendous US casualties within 24 hours of the start of any conflict, I would assume nothing will be done until NK is caught selling nuclear material/weapons. If they aren't, I assume there are works already in progress for destabilization ideas, but given the opponent in question, I doubt their efficacy. I would assume that NK gets some level of chinese material support, which might increase to offset the oil-blackmail discontinuance. This is a real pickle for the US. As you note, the potential geopolitical consequences of a first strike by the US are staggering in virtually all permutations.
I wonder what chicom perception is of the value of a minor ally causing the US so much inconvenience versus the possibility that the weapons of that same ally will be used to threaten them by a buyer one day? I assume they opt for the advantages of the former. I doubt NK pays attention to russia at all now, as they are likely receiving no support from them.
To: WoofDog123
I'm not familiar enough with the current status of Chinese/NK relations to offer an educated guess as to how much influence the Chinese have. I suspect it's less than we'd prefer right now, given a couple of realities.
The Chinese aren't communists anymore, despite the name of their "party." North Korea, though, remains more Stalinist than even Stalin was, so they're not seeing eye to eye on many matters. And, the leadership of NK is seriously wacko and unpredictable.
It might be the case that China can do precious little to defuse the situation even if they would be so inclined.
Nevertheless, it's important to stress to China that they need to step up here and take a role, and even some risk, in containing North Korea. So far, I haven't heard any Chinese comment on this matter at all.
38
posted on
12/25/2002 7:14:12 PM PST
by
Dog Gone
To: JZoback
Just how many of these "loose ends" Clinton left out there will Bush and the American people need to deal with? Well since the miniaturization of Nuclear weapons was traded for campaign funds to China, suddenly Korea has gone ballistic. Funny that the Islamic trade partners of NKorea are also doing the same. I suspect that Clinton had made a legacy after all.
World War III and the incineration of a large percentage of the worlds population. Sometimes I wonder if Clintons real name adds up to 666.
To: jobloss_recovery
The fact that the ChiComs seem to be in favor of nonproliferation bodes well for a peaceful settlement. Of course they are for non-proliferation. It doubles the ammount of cash they can get under the table reselling the M86 warhead designs to every tinpot dictator in the world. N Korea is a sock puppet on Chinas hand and they have their middle finger raised to operate this dictators mouth. China is getting filthy rich selling nukes and their delivery systems using the N Koreans as their screen. The buyers are Lybia, Syria, Yemen and through them, to Sadam.
The forces of Sauruman are collecting...
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