Washington Post: CIA interrogations verging on inhumane

Ha'aretz ^ | Last update - 08:08 26/12/2002 | Reuters

[Petronius]

As a culture, we have traditionally shunned torture. That some of our posters (and liberals like Alan Dershowitz) are second-guessing this stance disturbs me. On what grounds do we consider ourselves better than "them" if this highground is abandoned?

Are you suggesting that given atrocities from past wars we have no moral altitude, or that it scarcely matters what we do now? And I thought I was a cynic . . .

[R. Scott]

Stress and duress are commonly used techniques right here by our police forces of every level. What’s the big deal?

[DonQ]

I have no qualms about torturing these people to get information. You wanna talk about "inhumane", how about forcing a thousand New Yorkers to choose between being burned to death or jumping from a window 1000 feet above the sidewalk.

[angkor]

Check out Bob Woodward as the lead writer of this article.

Actually Bob Woodward and Susan Schmidt - both star reporters at the Post - are listed as contributors.

And thinking about the internal politics of editorial bullpens, it looks to me as if they took their names off the story because "there's no there there."

Then again, the story does carry Woodward's signature prose style, which I like to call "fictional reporting."

[Uncle Miltie]

"The picture that emerges is of a brass-knuckled quest for information"

This assertion is specifically contradicted by the article, which gives no evidence of physical harm being inflicted by the U.S.

So they were uncomfortable for awhile? That is not the same as "brass knuckles." Nor is it anywhere near Saddam's vats of acid.

[Peach]

Captives who refused to cooperate were sometimes kept standing or kneeling for hours, in black hoods or spray-painted goggles, the Post said, citing intelligence specialists said to be familiar with CIA interrogation methods.

That's paragraph 3 and the comments I was referring to. Doesn't sound like torture to me (darn it!). Most Americans reading this will either laugh at the Posts's feeble attempts to discredit our "inhumane" methods or, like me, feel disappointment we aren't being more aggressive.

[angkor]

As a culture, we have traditionally shunned torture.

And we still do. There is not a single assertion of fact in the article that torture is being employed.

[DooDahhhh]

That violin player is cute. Where did you get him. By the way, my sentiments as well.

[R. Scott]

“How many people in this country are really going to be worried about a bunch of suspected and likely terrorists being forced to stand in uncomfortable positions for hours and sleep deprived for 24 hours at a time”

WHAT! No comfy couch? No afternoon nap? Painted goggles so they can’t watch “friends”?
I am shocked, shocked I tell you! This is truly inhumane!

It might be better to turn them over to Army interrogators rather than the CIA wimps.

[angkor]

This assertion is specifically contradicted by the article, which gives no evidence of physical harm being inflicted by the U.S.

This is what I'm trying to point out as well.

The article clearly states that there is no evidence of torture being used, yet consumes many column-inches insinuating that this must be the case.

The article is a meretricious hack job.

[1riot1ranger]

FROM THE ARTICLE:
"...each of the current national security officials interviewed for the article defended the use of violence against captives as just and necessary, the Post said. They expressed confidence that the American public would back their view,..."

Sounds like these guys got it right-The Post missed the point.

[Peach]

Agreed. I think we aren't doing enough to get info from these guys. This doesn't even come close to approaching inhumane treatment. The entire article is a joke, and frankly, if this is all we're doing, I'm disappointed.

[angkor]

That's paragraph 3 and the comments I was referring to.Yes, you're correct.

The Ha'aretz article does say that, but the Post article - which Ha'aretz cites as its source - says nothing of the kind.

The ComPost's full discussion of this issue reads "At times they are held in awkward, painful positions..."

Of course its entirely up to the imagination what "awkward, painful positions" might be, and apparently Ha'aretz has taken that to mean "Captives who refused to cooperate were sometimes kept standing or kneeling for hours, in black hoods or spray-painted goggles," which the ComPost does not say.

But that is the entire point of this ambiguous hack job, to deceive and mislead its readers.

[H8klintoon]

As an MP officer in Vietnam I handeled POW's that were fresh from combat. I will not reveal various tactics used to urge co-operation. You have heard many of them. Some true, some not. Point being, war ain't nice. If it takes some "tough love", as we called it, to get information need to possibly save an American life...I think you get the picure.

These liberal journalists need to get some real experience and get into the compound with these "poor guys" for a few days. If they make it out, and they wouldn't, let's see how their story reads. We are being way too nice to these "combatants".

[Kenton]

I don't know what "awkward, painful positions" means, that's anyone's guess.

In Vietnam they used "tiger cages", bamboo cages that were too short to stand fully upright and too narrow to sit, so the prisoner had to stay standing in a half-crouch as long as they were confined that way.

Try standing in a forced half-crouch some time for 24 hours - not a pleasant experience at all. Not that I have any sympathy for these maggots, the gloves are off this time... our proscriptions against duress are intended to protect common POWs, not monsters who target defenseless civilians.

[blastdad51]

"And I just wonder who these foreign intelligence services are that practice a more hands on technique..."

I'll bet the Isrealis could extract a few pearls of intel from those snakes

[Matchett-PI]

LOL!

BTTT

[hford02]

Please explain for those of us without your mild manners -
How the H--- we are supposed to get information from these hardcore terrorists without the use of these techniques?

In Vietnam I saw several gooks fail flying lessons and commit suicide out the cargo bay of a chinook... the instructors were always South Vietnamese police or army.
I understand the talk to fly ratio was about five to one. HMMMMMM the good old days....

I love the smell of ragheads burning in the morning.

[angkor]

We are being way too nice to these "combatants".

What comes through from this article is exactly that: we are treating these beasts more-or-less like felony suspects on American soil, which is exactly what the ComPost would like to see (an expression of their preference that the war against these subhuman Islamists be conducted on CourtTV).

What's perversely amusing about this article is that they can find nothing but legal and humane treatment, so they bolster their suspicions with innuendo and fabrication (e.g., weaving their suspicions of torture with random quotes from dated and public State Department reports on the topic of torture).

Personally, I believe the Islamists should be introduced to the quality and effectiveness of Craftsman tool kits.

[atomic conspiracy]

How do we know that this article from the Com-Post is not a complete fabrication?
It has the usual earmarks of Goebbels-inspired multi-cultery: unnamed sources, broad characterizations based on selectively reached conclusions, a plethora of weasel-words and judgemental inferences, and a singular absence of hard fact to support any of this.
I don't pretend to know whether it is true or not, but I do know that there is no rational reason for any fair-minded person to believe a single word of it.