The Public And The Elite Are At Odds On Immigration.

The Washington Dispatch ^ | 12-28-02 | Thomas D. Segel

[Prerunner]

" the elite of our society "

Most of these people have extra borders, their gated communities.

[vikingchick]

Oh and don't forget FREE HEALTH CARE and SOCIAL SECURITY for the elders that don't work a day here!

That makes me so angry when they're telling AMERICANS there will never be any Social Security for our old age.

Unless we live until we're 97 years old, that is. Then we can collect.

[gubamyster]

Thank you for pointing out my grammatical error. I tend to make mistakes at 02:00. However, I am grateful that those perfect people in the world who have never made a mistake will be around to point out my errors.

[2sheep]

>A large new study reveals 60% of the American public view the present immigration situation as a “critical threat to the vital interests of the United States”. At the same time only 14% of our national leadership and opinion makers hold the same views. This reflects a huge disagreement between the people of America and the political elite.

Constitution:  by the People, for the People

New World Order socialism:  by the Elite, for the Elite...just say "its for the People."

[Vast Buffalo Wing Conspiracy]

"Garbage". Ummm. Coming from someone who pretends not to know that the term "White House" is not just used to refer to an inanimate building, but to a President and his administration, that's pretty rich.

On the other hand, your apparent literal-mindedness explains your complete inability to distinguish between facts and propaganda. Just because the White House calls it a "guest worker program" or some other euphemism, does not mean it is not, in fact, an amnesty. Read the fine print!

It's the same word game the left plays, when they relabel illegal aliens as "undocumented immigrants", or when they call racial quotas "hiring and admission goals".

It's just a bull$hit rhetorical shellgame, designed to fool the unwary (such as yourself), and Bush is as guilty of it as anyone on the left.

[Vast Buffalo Wing Conspiracy]

Actually, they are still servants; it is just that they no longer serve the people who elected them. But they are still serving someone.

[Vast Buffalo Wing Conspiracy]

You might have a point if the INS were actually attempting to do the job they were created to do, but they are not even making the attempt, for political reasons. Let's untie their hands before we write them off altogether. Your argument seems to be that because some government agencies are badly run, ergo they all must be badly run, so let's get rid of them all and have anarchy instead! Fine; we'll just funnel all the illegals to your property. You feed and clothe them, since "our" government is "obviously" incompetent "by its very nature" to enforce our laws or defend our borders, even though it had no problem doing this, in an efficient manner, 50 years ago. Now, did the nature of government change in the past 50 years, to make the INS incompetent, or was it the government's hidden agenda (re: immigration) which changed?

[Vast Buffalo Wing Conspiracy]

Anyone who does not believe there are elites setting the political agenda, and controlling the shape of politics, is ignorant of history, economics, sociology, political science, and common sense. Our current policies are most definitely dictated to satisfy the interests of our ruling elites. That's why it doesn't matter what "the people" think. If anything, it is "the people" who are mythical, not the elites.

[Joe Boucher]

Deep down I am aware of this but I do like to delude myself with beliefs otherwise.
I would still like to believe in a lot of other things too:
tooth fairy
Santa
we are all equal Etc Etc Etc.

[fastdraw]

If you move to a small town in the Midwest, you can easily avoid all of the problems you cited, including high rent. However, unless you're in health care, getting a job could be a problem.

[fastdraw]

"Let's untie their hands before we write them off altogether."

Your position is reasonable, but a tad naive.

"Your argument seems to be that because some government agencies are badly run, ergo they all must be badly run, so let's get rid of them all and have anarchy instead!"

You seem to be replying to someone else, rather than to what I actually said. However, it is true that they are ALL badly run. That's because the elites in our society have gone berserk across the board, not just in the INS.

"Now, did the nature of government change in the past 50 years, to make the INS incompetent, or was it the government's hidden agenda (re: immigration) which changed?"

Yes, both are true. Even more dramatically, federal "law enforcement" agencies used to be our friends, but now they treat us, the citizens, as if we were a military enemy. Did the nature of government change, or was it some hidden agenda? You tell me.

[Jim Noble]

>> a guest worker program with computer ID tracking that makes sure the immigrant worker goes home after a couple years<<

Right now, the government is afraid to "make" illegal immigrants from Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt "go home", so they don't.

When your "guest workers" have honors students in high school and are desparately in need of free kidney transplants, how are you going to "make sure they go home"?

[Jim Noble]

>>They only way you can make enforcement more effective is to change the current policy and laws<<

Say it louder!

Reality BUMP.

[Jim Noble]

>>Well he has until November of 2004<<

Dream on.

Bush has no right opposition, and if he did, it would be running in a country where Al Gore got 50 million people to vote for him.

[fastdraw]

Further elaborating, I would say that to the problem of bureaucratic resistance to reform, the solution is NOT anarchy. Consider the different approaches to economic reform in Russia and China in the past decade.

The Russians tried to introduce capitalism outwardly from the center of government, and thus stimulated every possible force of resistance. This approach failed.

By contrast, the Chinese established free enterprise zones after the pattern of Hong Kong, thus attacking the problem from the fringes toward the center. The result was that the entrepreneurs fled the controlled environment and entered the zones of freedom. The controlled portion of the country is thus "withering on the vine", and resistance at the center is irrelevant.

This latter approach to bureaucratic inertia and ineptitude is what Newt Gingrich alluded to in his famous statement about Medicare "withering on the vine". His vision was to offer alternatives so attractive that nobody would want Medicare any more. The Democrats deliberately misinterpreted this to claim that he advocated starving Medicare of funding, and to our everlasting misfortune, the voters bought the lie.

[sixmil]

The current thinking is to make a guest worker program with computer ID tracking that makes sure the immigrant worker goes home after a couple years.

You seriously think that is going to happen? Once you legalize them, they will stay.

[paltz]

Private and Public groups want to benefit from legal and illegal immigrants. It's all about the Mexican mowing a Beverly Hills' lawn or a politician telling a group of illegals they will grant them amnesty, social security, and health care for their vote. However, when events like the rape in Queens by illegals happen or 9/11 for that matter everyone bitches and complains that the INS isn't doing it's job to keep the illegals out.

[deport]

Just curious... which 3rd party banner is Tancredo going to run under?

[Crusader21stCentury]

The Party banner is of no concern. I intend to write Tancredo in if President Bush continues to fail to uphold his sworn duties.
While this will be of no concern to the President because of the state that I vote in, I can assure you it will concern Nancy Johnson who just narrowly squeeked by in the last election.