Catholic Lawmakers Confronted on Pro-Abortion Stance

CNS News ^ | 1/22/03 | Jeff Johnson

[Judith Anne]

The Church asks respectfully that if you are not a Catholic, please do not receive the Eucharist. For me, as a Catholic, it is the Body and Blood of Christ Himself.

[SMEDLEYBUTLER]

I need educating, please. Are non-Catholics not permitted to participate in Communion? I'm not Catholic, but I have taken Communion at a Midnight Mass.

No they are not. Do not do it again unless you convert to Catholicism and are in a state of grace.

In that case the host was blessed by the priest, but was actually distributed by nuns located at numerous locations in the auditorium.

Irrelevant as to the details. Do not do this again unless you convert to Catholicism and are in a state of grace.

Did I unintentionally cross a line?

Yes and unless you become a Catholic and are in a state of grace, do not do it again.

[SMEDLEYBUTLER]

"Catholic politicians cannot subscribe to any notion which equates freedom or democracy with a moral relativism that denies these moral principles," Gregory said in a statement.

Two words Wilton: Leon Panetta

[ventana]

Yes. V's wife.

[ventana]

Leon Panetta

Exactly! Gregory, the head of the USCCB; more evidence it ought to be disbanded. V's wife.

[uncbob]

The next step should be cracking down on the supposed Catholic Colleges in this country

[Slyfox]

Did I unintentionally cross a line?

Unfortunately, there are those in the Church who either ignore or do not know. How were you to know if you were not told?

Those receiving the Eucharist in the Roman Catholic Church must be prepared first. They need to be validly baptized and must have went through instruction. Also, they need to be in a state of grace, meaning no mortals sins on the soul.

Holy Communion is not just a wafer symbolically referencing Jesus. To us it is The Bread of Life, Jesus Himself. And He must be received only with those first prepared to receive Him.

I am sure you had know way of knowing all this.

[ZULU]

Catholics believe in "transubstantiation", i.e., they believe that during the Mass, the bread ("host") and wine are actually converted into the real body and blood of Christ and that only individuals who are practising Catholics and who have been absolved from their sins can partake of communion.

Protestant faiths believe the bread and wine in the Service are symbolical representations of Christ's body and blood, not His body and blood in actuality. I believe traditional Episcopalians fall somewhere in between with a belief called "consubstantiation".

If you are a Protestant, you can receive Communion as part of a symbolic act in any Protestant Church without actually being a member of that Church. Its a symbolical act of Christian fellowship. As Catholics have a different view of this, non-Catholics should not participate in Communion in a Catholic Church. I believe the Orthodox Churches have a similar view to the Catholic Churches.

The difference in this perspective can lead to some innocent confusion among Protestants attending Catholic services.

The Clintons, however, should have known better.

[Cboldt]

The old and tired "separation of church and state," eh? Well, this is not about making laws.

The Catholic Church has no obligation under law to keep as a member, a person who does not meet their expectations. The law does not compel the Catholic Church to accept all comers.

This is about whether the Catholic Church will stand by silently, while a public person asserts they are Catholics in good standing, when in fact they are not. The onus is on the Catholic Church to enforce its rules.

[SMEDLEYBUTLER]

The Clintons, however, should have known better.

The priest who distributed Communion should know better.

[Ragtime Cowgirl]

Others calling themselves Christians yet supporting even partial-birth abortion should be confronted, too....especially when they lead the weekly Senate prayer breakfasts:

 Remarks by Senator John Edwards NATIONAL BAPTIST CONGRESS of CHRISTIAN EDUCATION:
Charlotte, North Carolina Thursday, June 21, 2001:
"I believe that every child has worth and dignity in the eyes of God. I know that abiding faith in every soul is what guides the Baptist Convention. And it's what guides my work in the Congress. "

 

_______________________

Sen. John Edwards (D-NC) Remarks at House Party Chris & Kristin Sullivan's Home:
Concord, NH, February 2, 2002 :
Of course, pre-natal care for women is crucial. But without promoting that agenda, you know the anti-choice agenda. I'm a deep believer in choice, and I think it is a mistake to do anything that would undermine that. [Inaud.] you're right there are clearly ways to provide women with pre-natal care that don't specifically require that.
[Re. the new executive regulation for the Child Health Insurance Program, which would define a fetus as a child to allow women to get pre-natal care].

---

Edwards:

• Voted NO on maintaining ban on Military Base Abortions. (Jun 2000)
• Voted NO on banning partial birth abortions. (Oct 1999)
• Voted NO on disallowing overseas military abortions. (May 1999

[TontoKowalski]

Well, I asked for an education, and I certainly received one! I am grateful for the time you all took in replying. Responding to a few of the comments received, and further clarifying:

Someone mentioned that in most Protestant churches, the bread and wine are symbolic of the body and blood, and this is true. Also mentioned that communion was considered an act of fellowship with other Christians, and "rules" for participation are slim, which is also generally true. But not always:

Most Baptists, at least Southern Baptists, restrict participation in the Lord's Supper to those who have reached an age of consent and have been baptised by immersion. Some even restrict to members of that particular congregation only.

The pastor will just come right out and request that those not qualified (by that congregation's standards) refrain from partaking.

By contrast, when I attended a Methodist church, anyone could participate if they felt they were ready. Even children, and I mean toddlers, were encouraged to take the bread and juice.

Certainly I would NEVER have participated had I known that it was not permitted. When those in a state of grace were invited to participate, I did. Bringing up another issue: the phrase of "state of grace" which may have different meanings to my Catholic friends than it does to myself, a generally Protestant sort of Christian, and that probably added to the confusion.

Again, thank you to all for your replies, and be assured that I will take your counsel and not participate in that way again. FWIW, the Mass was beautiful. God bless you all.

[Judith Anne]

I think there is a statement in the front of the misselette that explains it better than I did, Tonto...I'm glad to hear you thought it was beautiful...so do I.

[ZULU]

God bless the Southern Baptists!

They are one of the few bulwarks yet remaining of real Christianity.

[copycat]

Daschle and Kennedy et al don't actually BELIEVE Catholic doctrine, like that they will burn in Hell for enabling the murder of unborn children...they just like to list their membership in the "Catholic Club" to enhance their resumes, similar to the way high school students join the school paper to help get them appeal to colleges.

[copycat]

Bringing up another issue: the phrase of "state of grace" which may have different meanings to my Catholic friends than it does to myself, a generally Protestant sort of Christian, and that probably added to the confusion.

I was taught as a Catholic kid that I could not receive the Host unless I was free of sin, and that I must repent my sins before receiving Communion. Also that if I did not have time for Confession before Mass, I could recite a brief Act of Contrition immediately before the Sacrament.

Is that a "state of grace"? I guess that argument could be made.

[Protagoras]

Are non-Catholics not permitted to participate in Communion?

I take communion all the time, in my Presbyterian church.

As to the Catholic church, it is my understanding that the church does not knowingly offer communion to non Catholics. Although I have personally had priests offer it to me after I identified myself as a protestant. I think they were setting their own rules on that one.

[Protagoras]

Yes and unless you become a Catholic and are in a state of grace, do not do it again.

Or God will get you. Or is it the priest? Or do you come to his house and harm him in some way? LOL, great stuff.

[Protagoras]

Certainly I would NEVER have participated had I known that it was not permitted.

Good choice, when in Rome,,, It's always a good idea to respect the wishes of your host.

Anyway, if you do, that bad old guy will get you! :^}