Saudis Plan to End U.S. Presence

The New York Times ^ | 02/08/2003 (for editions of 02/09/2003) | Patrick E. Tyler

[Rummyfan]

I'll believe it when I see it....

[bybybill]

Why would we go to war with the Saudis in 5-10 years? If you think about it, this plan, if true, sounds like a good deal for America--We pull our troops, they get rid of some of the crazys, and grant their people more freedom. What`s wrong with that?

[McGavin999]

This is excellent. It's going to be a hard row to hoe for them, but I think they can succeed. The hard part is going to be to get the clerics under control. If that happens, they can make it.

We won't need a presense in SA as long as we remain in Iraq helping them to build their democracy, and the SA young people will become very interested when the Iraqui people are free and prosperous, and the Iranian students finally manage to bring democracy to their own country. This whole thing could result and a free, prosperous and PRO-AMERICAN middle east.

[ez]

Should this happen, I predict the US will be involved in a military conflict against the Saudi's, within 5-10 years!

No doubt, and we'll be striking them from our new base in Iraq...

[Radioactive]

You said..."I'd rather see the headline U.S. PLANS TO END SAUDI PRESENCE."

I say...." Hope you heard Bush's speach in reguards to Hydrogen power. Me thinks the oil era is beginning to end and all this talk of war and control is about oil as of now. Bush knows that we need to become energy independent despite his connections with big oil. My hats off too him!

[okie01]

"That's the only long-term way to stop the terrorism. If they want to do it themselves, that's fine. Good luck to them."

Actually, it is far, far better that they do it themselves.

For the U.S. to take over and attempt reform, a la Iraq, in Arabia would require us to also assume the role of "Protector of the Holy Places of Islam". That just isn't going to fly -- it goes beyond infeasible, perhaps, all the way to impossible.

Instead, in order to effect change in Arabia, we would've had to operate covertly, fomenting (and controlling) a revolution. Or employ surrogates, like Turkey and Jordan.

Either would be an operation that I'm certain we'd rather not do.

For the Saudis to undertake this on their own (with significant, but invisible, moral and physical support from the U.S. no doubt) is, indeed, the best of all possible worlds.

The media will never mention it, of course, but this particular development constitutes a major foreign policy victory for the Bush administration.

[steveegg]

As long as ALL the reasons for the need to protect that peninsula are removed first,....

[steveegg]

One more thing; if we left Saudi Arabia, does anyone seriously think that Al Qaeda will suddenly stop attacking us? If so, I've got a hot news flash; Islamists don't stop until they're stopped cold.

[sourcery]

"Doing political reform in Saudi Arabia is like publishing the Kama Sutra in the Victorian Age"

What a fascinating comment for a Saudi Prince to make about his own country. He constructs a metaphore, using referents from Indian culture and British/Western history, to make a point about his own culture--and the point he makes is itself western in its focus and conceptual framework. The fact he is thinking and speaking about his own society in such terms is very revealing.

[txradioguy]

Well now we know the real reason we built the new bases in Qatar. Someone high up in the payscale saw this coming.

[Reagan Man]

>>>Our leaving the Saudi bases for Iraq will ease Wahabbist pressures on the Saudis.

If you believe this will relieve pressure from the puritanical Wahhabi sect, you're being naive. And turning to Iraq for the new US military complex in the region, willnot make the situation any better. Besides, asking us to leave in official terms, is still kicking us out. Frankly, I think either way, the House of Saud has big problems in their future. And lets not forget, this is coming from that favorite leftwing rag, the NY Times.

>>>Our departure will defuse the tension, not heighten it.

We'd have to leave the region for that to happen. The entire set of circumstances is too far along. Radical Islamic fundamentalism is here to stay and the war on terrorism won't be over for many years to come.

[Reagan Man]

>>>Why would we go to war with the Saudis in 5-10 years?

The House of Saud is on very thin ice and the Wahhbai sect wants control over "The Kingdom". The Wahhbai's want to advance their own agenda and that agenda supports terrorism and is extremely anti-American.

[Man of the Right]

The royal family would immediately lose power if they loosened up even a little. No chance. Ditto the expulsion of all U.S. troops.

[Proud Legions]

Still too new at this...this comment is really not just for txradioguy but I haven't figured out the multi-addressee thing yet. Help...someone educate me please!

txradioguy...you are absolutely correct. We have seen it coming for years.

This whole concept is not a bad one, depending on how the Iraqi, Afghan, and Pakistan situations play out. Permanently based military forces in Saudi do cause quite a lot of tension...we become the scapegoat the Saudi general population (and the Muslim world as a whole) blames for anything that goes wrong in their country. That is a bit ironic in that military to military contact is also the best way to build relations in almost all these countries (and I mean friendly contact...combined exercises, Foreign officers attending US officer schools, etc). But just because we take our forces out does not mean there still would not be military-to-military contact (such as we do with Bright Star in Egypt and with exercises in Jordan and Oman). We will keep our army and air bases in Kuwait and Qatar and our 5th Fleet in Bahrain...that is good enough. As long as we keep good relations with Saudi for "overflight" privledges (which will be easier to do with the reduced tensions brought on by a smaller military presence) we will be in good shape militarily speaking. Remember, the only real Army forces there full time (aside from ARCENT-Saudi folks with a very small footprint) is a Patriot Battalion that protects the Saudis against Iraqi Scuds, and a air base much smaller than the one in Qatar. The Saudis (1) won't need that Patriot Battalion to protect them against Iraq scuds when we take down Saddam, and (2) can fend for themselves...they have now bought there own Patriots.

[hoosierham]

I concur on the need for effective U.S. controlled broadcast facilities; but the Voice of America was gutted, outsourced, land sold to real estate developers, antennas sold for scrap metal UNDER THE CLINTONS !!!!

[rbmillerjr]

I am glad the Saudis are planning this and hope they carry it out.

I like clarity.

...it will be much easier to attack them the next time they are harboring and financing terrorists.

[JerseyHighlander]

Although Bahrain is an extremely small microcosm of SA, the election results there DO NOT bode well for moderate and modernist Islamic parties and even worse for secular political parties in Saudi Arabia.

This is just a hunch, but the Saudis will have an extreme problem when registering people to vote in the country. The Wahhabi apartheid system in place in the country will become extremely apparent. The election system will probably discourage the young from voting in urban areas, while encouraging youth voting in the far suburbs and western and southern areas of the country. Age, property ownership, minimum income, head of household status, religious devoteness standards will all be used to vie for limits on participation.

Does anyone have any polling data within Saudi Arabia? Coverage of Saudi Arabia's reform movement is even less distributed for American consumption than Iran's reform movement.

[okie01]

"Radical Islamic fundamentalism is here to stay and the war on terrorism won't be over for many years to come."

I quite agree. But with our having a secure base of operations in a liberated Iraq and the Saudis pledged to clean up their own house, we'll have gone a long way toward ending the war on terrorism.

[Reagan Man]

>>> ... and the Saudis pledged to clean up their own house ...

We shall see, but I don't have much faith in the House of Saud and their ability to clean up their own house.

[SBprone]

Saudi Arabia in an interesting case. Lots of countries have governments that hate us while the people range from apathetic to friendly. I think Saudi is one of the few places in the world where average citizens really hate our guts.

It doesn't matter what happens to their government. We will still be hunting Saudi terrorists for a long time to come.