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To: Gunslingr3
Of course stealing is flat-out wrong. I never said otherwise.

That doesn't justify the use of lethal force, either legally or morally, by an absent property owner.

"Disrespect me and I'll kill you" might be the code in the Wild West or in the 'hood, but it has no place in a civilized society. We have police and courts to deal with lawbreakers. We don't need or want individual citizens setting themselves up as their own justice system.
47 posted on 02/25/2003 9:43:42 AM PST by You Dirty Rats
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To: You Dirty Rats
That doesn't justify the use of lethal force, either legally or morally, by an absent property owner.

Anyone seeking to enslave me, by helping themselves to the product of my labor, can expect to be met with lethal force. You're free to not defend yourself and the product of your labors as you see fit. Don't expect the rest of us to just smile, nod and wink when people violate our rights.

"Disrespect me and I'll kill you"

Why alter what I said? I said if you violate my rights I will defend them. Once you've abrogated the concept of individual rights, once you've introduced the concept of force to our social interaction - prepare yourself for force. I have no sympathy for theives and their sympathizers. At the end of the day, if the jerk had the good sense to respect the rights of others he'd still be alive to get drunk and coked up.

We have police and courts to deal with lawbreakers. We don't need or want individual citizens setting themselves up as their own justice system.

They're too busy making money off the War on Drugs to chase people for petty things like crime. Ask the English how it's working out, since their courts have essentially eliminated their right to self defense and the cops have announced they're just worried about rape, murder and hate crimes.

Cops and courts are an aid to the defense of individual rights, but the onus remains on the individual to be vigilant against incursions of his rights. The state cannot and will not always be there. I want drunk, coked up burglars to know in advance their actions can and will be detrimental to their well being. I'd rather show up at my property and find a theif's toasty corpse outside than find him inside my property waiting to ambush me. You think being able to call the police to come clean up the mess after he breaks in or ambushes me is the best option. We disagree...

51 posted on 02/25/2003 10:19:44 AM PST by Gunslingr3
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To: You Dirty Rats; HamiltonJay; Gunslingr3; Wurlitzer
"Of course stealing is flat-out wrong. I never said otherwise. That doesn't justify the use of lethal force, either legally or morally, by an absent property owner."

Much of this dialogue between all us reasonable fellows makes me wonder whether we are wasting our breath. In years past, horse-stealing was punishable by hanging, not because the punishment fit the crime but because hanging is an awfully good deterrent.

When thieves steal as casually and repeatedly as the coke-addled perp in our story, maybe we should allow the use of lethal force in reply. Criminals' greatest motivation against committing their deeds is fear.

I have thought many times in the past that carjacking should be punishable by death; and that any crime committed that endangers the life of any innocent, whether in a vehicle or on the street, should be punishable by death. Sounds cruel by today's standards but a mere hundred years ago this was considered fair justice.

Wonder if our nation will ever return to days like that?

52 posted on 02/25/2003 10:19:51 AM PST by tom h
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