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SENATE ESTRADA FILIBUSTER (Live Thread)

Posted on 02/26/2003 6:33:24 AM PST by RobFromGa

Senate Takes Up Estrada again-- 930am EST

Up Now...

C-SPAN2 Internet Link



TOPICS: Breaking News; Crime/Corruption; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: estrada; estradafilibuster; filibuster; hatch; judiciary; miguelestrada; senate
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No one else started it, so here it is...
1 posted on 02/26/2003 6:33:24 AM PST by RobFromGa
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To: Howlin
could you ping the Live list?
2 posted on 02/26/2003 6:34:00 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
Frist up first.

Frist expects a long day and a long night...

3 posted on 02/26/2003 6:35:07 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
FREE MIGUEL!
Fax to Landrieu(LA) @202-224-9735
Fax to Graham (FL) @202-224-2237
Fax to Lincoln (AR) @202-228-1371
If we get those two of those three to cave, the tide will turn/
4 posted on 02/26/2003 6:36:35 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
Frist has letter to President signed by 52 senators backing Estrada, enough to confirm. (Zell Miller?)

Letter entered into the record.
5 posted on 02/26/2003 6:37:31 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
We the undersigned Majority, commend you on your excellent choice,

It was Zell Miller!


6 posted on 02/26/2003 6:38:42 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
This is great. Thanks for posting.

It's "Smoke the Rats out of their Hole" time.
7 posted on 02/26/2003 6:39:18 AM PST by leadpenny
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To: leadpenny
Again, they said we'll be up late into the night,

Reid says obvious that the letter to the President makes it clear, not enough votes,

Reid sees three choices:

1. pull the nomination so we can concentrate on global warming report (not kidding)

2. or, have Majority file for cloture (not going to happen)

3. or, we can stay here forever, (YEAH LETS go with that one)

Hatch up now...
8 posted on 02/26/2003 6:42:04 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
I'm here reporting for duty, Sir

So what time do the games begin?
9 posted on 02/26/2003 6:43:03 AM PST by Mo1 (DC Chapter .. Patriots Rally for America IV .. on Saturday, March 1st)
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To: RobFromGa
Hatch has a fourth choice,

Hatch: Let's Vote!

Hatch: There are 55 votes, we can be done soon.

Hatch: This is not an incidental issue to us.

10 posted on 02/26/2003 6:43:15 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: Mo1
Hatch is up now. See my previous posts,

11 posted on 02/26/2003 6:43:46 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
There's a challenge to the Dems. Bet they didn't expect that.

Hope they read and add the letter to Schumer (and certain other Senators) dated February 24, 2003 into the record also.

12 posted on 02/26/2003 6:43:48 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: RobFromGa
GO HATCH GO!!

Oh wow .. I need another cup of coffee
13 posted on 02/26/2003 6:45:19 AM PST by Mo1 (DC Chapter .. Patriots Rally for America IV .. on Saturday, March 1st)
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To: RobFromGa
Was that Durbin , Hatch refused to yeild for a question?
14 posted on 02/26/2003 6:46:08 AM PST by Mo1 (DC Chapter .. Patriots Rally for America IV .. on Saturday, March 1st)
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To: RobFromGa
Reporting for duty! Thanks for starting the thread. I didn't realize they were going to start this early.

Must be those doctor's hours. Hehehe.

15 posted on 02/26/2003 6:48:39 AM PST by Miss Marple
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To: RobFromGa

16 posted on 02/26/2003 6:49:47 AM PST by Consort
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To: RobFromGa
Everyone

Call your Senator NOW!

Let them know you want the Democrats to filibuster 24/7 starting NOW!

17 posted on 02/26/2003 6:49:48 AM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Sacajaweau
Here's the Gonzalez letter to Schumer for those who missed it: Awesome rebuttal.

With the Democratic filibuster of the appeals-court nomination of Miguel Estrada continuing today in the Senate, White House counsel Alberto Gonzales has responded to comments made over the weekend by Sen. Charles Schumer, a leader of the opposition to Estrada.  In an appearance on ABC's This Week With George Stephanopoulos, Schumer claimed, among other things, that Estrada ''answered no questions'' at his confirmation hearing; that ''no judicial nominee that I'm aware of for such a high court has ever had so little of a record''; that ''there is no legal precedent'' against turning over Justice Department documents Estrada wrote while working in the Solicitor General's office; and that Democrats ''are not filibustering'' the nomination.   In his letter to Schumer, seen in its entirety below, Gonzales responds to each of those points, as well as some others. — Byron York

February 24, 2003

Dear Senator Schumer:

       Based on your public comments yesterday, I am concerned that you may have inaccurate and incomplete information about Miguel Estrada's qualifications and about the historical practice with respect to judicial confirmations.  Therefore, I write to respectfully reiterate and explain our conclusion that you and certain other Senators are applying an unfair double standard — indeed, a series of unfair double standards — to Miguel Estrada.

       First, your request for confidential attorney-client memoranda Mr. Estrada wrote in the Office of Solicitor General seeks information that, based on our review, has not been demanded from past nominees to the federal courts of appeals.  We are informed that the Senate has not requested memoranda such as these for any of the 67 appeals court nominees since 1977 who had previously worked in the Justice Department — including the seven nominees who had previously worked in the Solicitor General's office.  Nor have such memoranda been demanded from nominees in similar attorney-client situations: The Senate has not demanded confidential memoranda written by judicial nominees who had served as Senate lawyers, such as memoranda written by Stephen Breyer as a Senate counsel before Justice Breyer was confirmed to the First Circuit in 1980. Nor has the Senate demanded confidential memoranda written by judicial nominees who had served as law clerks to Supreme Court Justices or other federal or state judges.  Nor has the Senate demanded confidential memoranda written by judicial nominees who had worked for private clients.

       The very few isolated examples you have cited were not nominees for federal appeals courts. Moreover, those situations involved Executive Branch accommodations of targeted requests for particular documents about specific issues that were primarily related to allegations of malfeasance or misconduct in a federal office.  We respectfully do not believe these examples support your request. Our conclusion about the general lack of support and precedent for your position is buttressed by the fact that every living former Solicitor General (four Democrats and three Republicans) has strongly opposed your request and stated that it would sacrifice and compromise the ability of the Justice Department to effectively represent the United States in court.  In short, the traditional practice of the Senate and the Executive Branch with respect to federal appeals court nominations stands in contrast to your request here and supports our conclusion that an unfair double standard is being applied to Miguel Estrada.  (Also, contrary to your suggestion yesterday, please note that no one in the Executive Branch has reviewed these memoranda since President Bush took office in January 2001.)

       Second, you suggested that ''no judicial nominee that I'm aware of, for such a high court, has ever had so little of a record.'' I respectfully disagree. Miguel Estrada has been a very accomplished lawyer, trying cases before federal juries, briefing and arguing numerous appeals before federal and state appeals courts, and arguing 15 cases before the Supreme Court, among his other significant work. His record and breadth of experience exceeds that of many judicial nominees, which is no doubt why the American Bar Association — which you have labeled the ''gold standard'' — unanimously rated him ''well-qualified.'' In noting yesterday that Mr. Estrada's career had been devoted to ''arguing for a client,'' you appeared to imply that only those with prior judicial service (or perhaps ''a lot of [law review] articles'') may serve on the federal appeals courts.  But five of the eight judges currently serving on the D.C. Circuit had no prior judicial service at the time of their appointments. Indeed, Supreme Court Justices Rehnquist, White, and Powell — to name three of the most recent — had not served as judges before being confirmed to the Supreme Court.  And like Mr. Estrada, two appointees of President Clinton to the D.C. Circuit (Judge David Tatel and Judge Merrick Garland) had similarly spent their careers ''arguing for a client,'' but were nonetheless confirmed.

       As the Chief Justice noted in his 2001 Year-End Report, moreover, ''[t]he federal Judiciary has traditionally drawn from a wide diversity of professional backgrounds.'' The Chief Justice cited Justice Louis Brandeis, Justice John Harlan, Justice Byron White, Judge Thurgood Marshall (as nominee to the Second Circuit), Judge Learned Hand, and Judge John Minor Wisdom as just a few examples of great judges who had spent virtually their entire careers ''arguing for a client'' before becoming Supreme Court Justices or federal appeals court judges. As these examples show, had the ''arguing for a client'' standard been applied in the past, it would have deprived the American people of many of our most notable appellate judges.  Based on our understanding, this standard has not been applied in the past.  This further explains why we have concluded that an unfair double standard is being applied to Miguel Estrada.

       Third, you stated that ''when you went to those hearings, Mr. Estrada answered no questions.'' The record demonstrates otherwise. Mr. Estrada answered more than 100 questions at his hearing (and another 25 in follow-up written answers).  He explained in some detail his approach to judging on many issues, and did so appropriately without providing his personal views on specific legal or policy questions that could come before him — which is how previous judicial nominees of Presidents of both parties have appropriately answered questions.  Indeed, at his hearing, Mr. Estrada was asked and answered more questions, and did so more fully, than did President Clinton's appointees to this same court. Judge David Tatel was asked a total of three questions at his hearing. Judges Judith Rogers and Merrick Garland were each asked fewer than 20 questions.  The three appointees of President Clinton — combined — thus answered fewer than half the number of questions at their hearings that Mr. Estrada answered at his hearing.  What is more, like Mr. Estrada, both Judge Rogers and Judge Garland declined to give their personal views on disputed legal and policy questions at the hearing. Judge Rogers refused to give her views when asked about the notion of an evolving Constitution.  And Mr. Garland did not answer questions about his personal views on the death penalty, stating that he would follow precedent.  In short, we believe that your criticism of Mr. Estrada's answers at his hearing reveals that another unfair double standard is being applied to Mr. Estrada.

       Fourth, you stated that the Founding Fathers ''came to the conclusion that the Senate ought to ask a whole lot of questions'' of judicial nominees.  We respect the Senate's constitutional role in the confirmation process, and we agree that the Senate should make an informed judgment consistent with its traditional role and practices. But your characterization of the Senate's role with respect to judicial nominations is not consistent with our reading of historical or traditional practice.  Alexander Hamilton explained that the purpose of Senate confirmation is to prevent appointment of ''unfit characters from State prejudice, from family connection, from personal attachment, or from a view to popularity.'' The Federalist 76.  The Framers anticipated that the Senate's approval would not often be refused unless there were ''special and strong reasons for the refusal.'' Id. Moreover, the Senate did not hold hearings on judicial nominees for much of American history, and the hearings for lower-court nominees in modern times traditionally have not included the examination of personal views that you have advocated. (My letter of February 12, 2003, to Senators Daschle and Leahy contains more detail on this point.)  Indeed, just a few years ago, Senator Biden made clear, consistent with the traditional practice, that he would vote to confirm an appeals court judge if he were convinced that the nominee would follow precedent and otherwise was of high ability and integrity.

       In short, it appears that you are seeking to change the Senate's traditional standard for assessing judicial nominees.  We respect your right to advocate a change, but we do not believe that the standard you seek to apply is consistent with the Framers' vision, the traditional Senate practice, or the Senate's treatment of President Clinton's nominees. Rather, we believe a new standard is being devised and applied to Miguel Estrada.

       Fifth, you stated yesterday that a ''filibuster'' is not an appropriate term to describe what has been occurring in the Senate.  We respectfully disagree. Democrat Senators have objected to unanimous consent motions to schedule a vote, and they have indicated that they will continue to do so.  That tactic is historically and commonly known as a filibuster, and is a dramatic escalation of the tactics used to oppose judicial nominees.  Indeed, in 1998, Senator Leahy stated: ''I have stated over and over again on this floor that I would refuse to put an anonymous hold on any judge; that I would object and fight against any filibuster on a judge, whether it is somebody I opposed or supported; that I felt the Senate should do its duty. If we don't like somebody the President nominates, vote him or her down.  But don't hold them in this anonymous unconscionable limbo, because in doing that, the minority of Senators really shame all Senators.'' 144 Cong. Rec. S6522 (June 18, 1998).  In our judgment, the tactics now being employed again show that Miguel Estrada is receiving differential treatment.

* * *

       As I have said before, I appreciate and respect the Senate's constitutional role in the confirmation process.  You have expressed concern that you do not know enough about Mr. Estrada's views, but you have not submitted any follow-up questions to him.  We respectfully submit that the Senate has ample information and has had more than enough time to consider questions about the qualifications and suitability of a nominee submitted more than 21 months ago.  Most important, we believe that a majority of Senators have now concluded that they possess sufficient information on Mr. Estrada and would vote to confirm him.  We believe it is past time for the Senate to vote on this nominee, and we urge your support.


Sincerely,
/s/
Alberto R. Gonzales
Counsel to the President


Copy: The Honorable Bill Frist
The Honorable Thomas A. Daschle
The Honorable Orrin Hatch
The Honorable Patrick Leahy

18 posted on 02/26/2003 6:49:48 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: Miss Marple
What Vermont Senator is Hatch talking about? Using his own words from long ago about not using filibusters?

Did anyone watch Curt Weldon on the house floor last night around 11 pm - He was sooooo fired up, and telling horrific stories about POW's treatment during the last Gulf War.

19 posted on 02/26/2003 6:51:13 AM PST by KE
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To: KE
Leahy
20 posted on 02/26/2003 6:51:40 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
make no mistake about it....the Republicans are filibustering the filibuster....in order to make the Democrats look like obstructionists an racists for even longer on the public stage...
21 posted on 02/26/2003 6:51:50 AM PST by grumple
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To: RobFromGa
Durbin asking for Confidential Documents again...
22 posted on 02/26/2003 6:52:29 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
Everyone should fax a copy to Hitlery with AND CERTAIN OTHER SENATORS underlined!!
23 posted on 02/26/2003 6:52:44 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: RobFromGa
Phi Kap Mom posted this earlier on the Wow! thread:

Make the call!1


If you call Senator Frist office, they will transfer you to to the Majority Leader's comment line -- call that comment line and encourage Senator Frist to go 24/7 to make the RATs filibuster.

They are waiting for support for 24/7 and let's give it to them. Ask for the Senator Majority Leader's Comment line when you call the following:

(202) 224-3344

Maybe we should start calling Hispanic groups with our support as well and ask them to keep the pressure on.


250 posted on 02/25/2003 8:52 AM PST by PhiKapMom (Bush/Cheney 2004)

I called and the lady was very nice; I also asked her to pass the message on to my GOP Senator and she said she would!
24 posted on 02/26/2003 6:52:55 AM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: RobFromGa
Is this the real filibuster, or "filibuster lite"?
25 posted on 02/26/2003 6:52:58 AM PST by clintonh8r (It is better to be feared than to be respected.)
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To: Mo1
NO DOCUMENT PRODUCTION.
26 posted on 02/26/2003 6:53:01 AM PST by hobbes1
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To: Salvation
I called both of my Senators - please don't post the state or the Senators that you call.

EvilDUers will get the names and call themselves to try and stem the tide. Make them frustrated by not giving them any help.
27 posted on 02/26/2003 6:53:24 AM PST by mabelkitty
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To: RobFromGa
Hatch says no administration with Constituitional understanding would give up those documents...terrible precedent.
28 posted on 02/26/2003 6:53:37 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa; 3catsanadog; ~Kim4VRWC's~; A CA Guy; A Citizen Reporter; abner; AFPhys; agrace; ...
Filibuster ping!
29 posted on 02/26/2003 6:55:40 AM PST by Howlin (Time to pull the trigger!)
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To: RobFromGa
Thanks for posting that letter!
30 posted on 02/26/2003 6:56:16 AM PST by Howlin (Time to pull the trigger!)
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To: RobFromGa
Sounds like a personal message to Hillary, our Constitutional expert. (yeh, right!!)
31 posted on 02/26/2003 6:56:43 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: RobFromGa
Bennett got caught on the floor yesterday all by himself, (He kept looking around for someone on the Rep. side to ask,) and ended agreeing to maybe they could get some more info to the dems either in paper work, or meetings with Estrada again. This is what Durbin is hitting on this morning.
32 posted on 02/26/2003 6:56:52 AM PST by KE
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To: Howlin
Hatch doing it right.

But with Nelsons statement in the papers today, it is all but over.

If the (R)s were smart they would go 24/7 today, so they can force the media spotlight, and have their staffers put out Nelsons quote.

Game Over.

33 posted on 02/26/2003 6:57:16 AM PST by hobbes1
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To: RobFromGa
Frist has letter to President signed by 52 senators backing Estrada, enough to confirm. (Zell Miller?) Letter entered into the record.

Heck, just seat him on the court, then. Let the Dems file a lawsuit and makes themselves look even more like jackasses.

34 posted on 02/26/2003 6:58:04 AM PST by Sloth (I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!)
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To: hobbes1
Oh heck I was going to type something but I got a phone call when I hit reply and now I can remember what I wanted to post .. LOL


OK .. Who brought the Coffee
35 posted on 02/26/2003 6:58:17 AM PST by Mo1 (DC Chapter .. Patriots Rally for America IV .. on Saturday, March 1st)
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To: Mo1
You were about to either
A: Agree with me ...or
B: Tell me how right I am...; )
36 posted on 02/26/2003 6:59:17 AM PST by hobbes1
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To: RobFromGa
I called Frist this morning; circuits busy at first, good sign!

Then I said, "go to the mattresses"!

Bill Nelson is not supporting the filibuster, but he has not come out in support of Estrada.

Graham is still Graham.

Freep away!
37 posted on 02/26/2003 6:59:20 AM PST by votelife (call Frist/Hatch and support Estrada!)
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To: Howlin; All
Well I helped get it rolling, I've got to leave now and won't be back today. Have fun.
38 posted on 02/26/2003 7:00:14 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: RobFromGa
The Democrats strategy on this is going to backfire bigtime. I guess they don't understand that the American Public voted in more Republican senators than democratic ones this past election cycle, giving Republicans control of the legislative process. If the Democrats were to filibuster everything, they would essentially be denying the right of the American People's majority. Not a good thing to do, short-term or long-term. People don't forget that easily, and if they continue this process they are going to lose even more seats in the next election cycle.
39 posted on 02/26/2003 7:00:42 AM PST by rs79bm
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To: Mo1
Oh heck I was going to type something but I got a phone call when I hit reply and now I can remember what I wanted to post .. LOL

lol... no wonder you couldn't remember that 9/11 quote from you in that article -- you can't even remember your posts for a few minutes!

40 posted on 02/26/2003 7:00:51 AM PST by Sloth (I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!)
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To: votelife
Nelson did, in fact, say that he supported, and would vote to confirm, Estrada.
41 posted on 02/26/2003 7:00:54 AM PST by TontoKowalski
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To: hobbes1
Hatch saying their Liberal media friends are ignoring the fact that all the past Sol. Generals said NO to releasing memos and papers, and that 3 of the SG were DemS.

dEMS are taking away a great Hispanics chance to advance - yelling.

Estrada said yesterday it is worth going through this. (Talked to hatch yesterday). He would follow the law as he always has.

If the Dems force 60 votes, never again will any president be able to get through their choices. If the dems filibuster hatch says "What's good for the goose, is good for the gander". hahah

42 posted on 02/26/2003 7:01:36 AM PST by KE
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To: RobFromGa
In 2000 all we heard, over and over from the Dems, was, "Every vote must count!"

Now, all we hear from the Dems, over and over, is, "No vote must count if we won't like the outcome!"

When are we going to slam this down their lying throats?

43 posted on 02/26/2003 7:02:04 AM PST by pabianice
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To: votelife
Bill Nelson is not supporting the filibuster, but he has not come out in support of Estrada.

I think Nelson has said he will vote FOR him

44 posted on 02/26/2003 7:02:07 AM PST by RobFromGa (It's Time to Bomb Saddam!)
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To: rs79bm
Is it true the President is going to speak about the war tonight? If so, every lead in will be "Democrats fillibustering Miguel Estrada while the President readies the country for war"

HHHAAAA HAAHHHAAA!
45 posted on 02/26/2003 7:02:18 AM PST by mabelkitty
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To: Sloth
Heck, just seat him on the court, then.

The DNC would have a collective stroke.

46 posted on 02/26/2003 7:02:55 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Mo1
Just a thought, but if the vote were set for say Thursday in prime time with national coverage, I'll bet he sails through.

Call their friggin bluff and call for cloture!

47 posted on 02/26/2003 7:03:07 AM PST by Cold Heat
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To: TontoKowalski
well, his office says something different. Maybe they thought I was a democrat and I was made that he supported the filibuster, so he didn't want to say he supported the nominee...Still if he does, you'd think he'd say so.

Call Bill Nelson and see if he supports Estrada!
48 posted on 02/26/2003 7:03:22 AM PST by votelife (call Frist/Hatch and support Estrada!)
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To: hobbes1
Yea .. that must be it
49 posted on 02/26/2003 7:03:32 AM PST by Mo1 (DC Chapter .. Patriots Rally for America IV .. on Saturday, March 1st)
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To: RobFromGa; votelife
Yes, this AM. called opposition to Estrada, purely "Political"....
50 posted on 02/26/2003 7:03:48 AM PST by hobbes1
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