Microsoft WinXP Update spies on other PC software

The Inquirer ^ | Tuesday 25 February 2003 | Inquirer Staff

[Knitebane]

Software components reported to Vole Central

By INQUIRER staff: Tuesday 25 February 2003, 14:21

A REPORT ON a German site claims that Microsoft extracts more information from a person's PC when the update Windows facility is used running the WinXP operating system.

According to tecCHANNEL, it has deciphered which data is transferred to Microsoft Central whenever you connect to its update web site.

The site's tecDUMP utility intercepts messages which were deciphered in the course of an exchange with Microsoft.

And, the site claims, the information can pass on to Microsoft a list of all of the software installed on an individual's computer, including software manufactured by other manufacturers.

According to tecCHANNEL, this information is more extensive than is necessary for the purpose. The site said Microsoft has not yet replied in detail to its concerns about passing sensitive data.

The story starts here. µ

[George W. Bush]

They have Tiberian Sun and Red Alert and they're testing Red Alert 2 now.

One would hope that Yuri's Revenge will follow shortly after RA2. Yuri is high on my list personally. I don't want to switch without it. Been playing it too long to stop, I guess.

[gore3000]

How does a company update your system without knowing what is currently installed on that system?

Well, they could ask. However, according to MS you are nobody and they can do what they please with your computer.

I wonder what would happen to MS products if they put on the box nice and big "By buying this you give us the right to snoop into whatever you have and do whatever we please with your system". That is what they are doing and they should have to get a signed release if that is what they are going to do.

[gore3000]

Everyone knows of a neighbor's cousin's ex-roommate's son-in-law's friend's ex-classmate that says that he received a threatening letter from MS. The rules of illegal search without a warrant still apply.

Garbage. They still do it, they even put it in their EULA's where no one will read it. We have all seen MS programs 'call home'. IE does it all the time, so does MS Media Player. This is well documented.

[gore3000]

I've recently installed WinXP on a client's desktop. It was a much more tedious process than a RedHat 8.0 install.

It certainly is easy. I use Mandrake and in less than a half hour you have your internet set up, your printer going, your video running and what you do not get in windows - you have hundreds of programs ready to run with just a click. All that in less than a half hour and you do not have to worry about viruses.

[Hodar]

Fine, if you want to believe that MS is very concerned about your computer; go right ahead. Who am I to persuade you otherwise. I mean, I'm just a lowly R&D engineer working in the computer industry for the past 10 years.

How else would you propose your software be kept current? New drivers come out, updates to DirectX, OpenGL, and new media types emerge fairly frequently. Security holes are found, and macro-virus's are written.

Please note, you have the OPTION of not allowing the update. If you chose not to, it's your machine, your financial information, and your property that is at risk; not mine.

Funny, isn't it; that despite a worldwide 'spy' network in MS, there isn't a single case against MS for invading privacy. Realnetworks (Real Player)got ding'd, so have a few others. But not MS.

[Knitebane]

That's exactly what Microsoft's service does!

Wrong. Did you even bother to read the article?

[Knitebane]

That's easy for you and easy for me, but most users wouldn't have a clue as to how to do such a thing.

What part of advanced features didn't you understand?

Most people may not have a clue about how to do such a thing, but then, most users won't ever need to. The video card works normally for the majority of purposes just fine with the default drivers, including high resolution, color depth, virtual desktops, OpenGL and anti-aliased fonts.

I export my TV output to a web server so that others on my network can watch TV. This requires some advanced video drivers.

I anticipate that within 2 years RedHat and the other major Linux installations will be easier to configure than Microsoft and that Microsoft will be adopting Linux solutions to their own problems.

Linux installation is already easier than Microsoft.

We've already seen that tact taken with the .NET programming languages which, if used correctly, can eliminate DLL Hell caused by COM registry issues. IMHO, COM was designed by a demon.

.NET is no better. .NET retains all of COMs problems and introduces many new ones. This is commonly called "backward combatibility" and is generally considered to be a bad thing. Of course, as with all of the other bad things Microsoft has done, they don't seem to care.

[rw4site]

Re: "It takes some work and lots of reading, so don't expect it to fire up and run just right the first day. But I think you'll find it worth it in the future." 12 posted on 02/26/2003 11:22 AM CST by Siegfried

Funny, you should say that. I just this afternoon pulled a Windows XP hard drive and replaced it with a brand new 40GB Maxtor. I used my just arrived 3 disk set of Mandrake 9.0 and installed it in less than thirty minutes. I am still trying to configure it, but it is up and running and everything (Mozilla browser and email) seems to work. In fact I am using it now while listening to Quinn with the XMMS player.

Yes, I have a way to go to learn it and to use it to its advantages, but as of now my total experience with Linux is less than five hours. It may become my default OS.

Eat your heart out Bush2000!

[rw4site]

I can't believe it. Shortly after my post #48, I began to have a "bush200.com" web site take over my browser. I would kill it and it would return within a short time.

Is it possible that linux can be controlled by someone (not necessarily Bush2000) hacking me to prove their point that Linux is also vulnerable? Odd! BTW, I'm running with a cable modem into a Linksys BEFSR42 ver. 2 Router into a four port hub, then to my PC.

Any help with answers will be greatly appreciated. Like I said. I am in the beginning stage and I have much to learn.

[Bush2000]

Heh heh heh ... ;-p

[rw4site]

Is that an admission of guilt?

I really would like to know if it was caused by an external agent.

Back in '98, as a novice, Windows 95 cost me about $5000 trying to get it to run more than 30 minutes without crashing. It was not a loss as I wound up with three PCs and a bit of an education about Windows. Windows 98 fixed that problem for me. Then Windows 98 SE, Windows 2000 Professional, and now XP. I like W2K and XP very much, but I have missed getting frustrated using systems that VERY rarely gives me a problem so I ordered Mandrake 9.0 to have something to raise my frustration level back up to a healthy position. ;-)

[DallasMike]

NET is no better. .NET retains all of COMs problems and introduces many new ones.

I'm a programmer and am also in charge of producing our company's software installations. .NET does not retain COM's problems and in fact makes it significantly easier to install and maintain software. Trust me on this one.

Now repeat after me: "It's okay to enjoy more than one operating system -- the OS one prefers at any given time is not a matter of life or death." I've got both my Linux box and my Windows 2000 box running as I speak and only need to turn a knob to switch between the two. There are good things about both systems and there are weak things about both systems. That's okay.

[Knitebane]

.NET does not retain COM's problems and in fact makes it significantly easier to install and maintain software. Trust me on this one.

No. I won't trust you. And I won't trust Microsoft either.

There are various and sundry reasons for that, but in this particular case it's because that Microsoft themselves called .NET COM3 internally up until about 1998. Microsoft has to retain backward combatibility because their underlying OS code is such a mess. .NET simply removed the COM/DCOM bugs into the abstraction layer where you don't see it. But they're still there.

Now repeat after me: "It's okay to enjoy more than one operating system -- the OS one prefers at any given time is not a matter of life or death." I've got both my Linux box and my Windows 2000 box running as I speak and only need to turn a knob to switch between the two. There are good things about both systems and there are weak things about both systems. That's okay.

Now repeat after me: "When a company exhibits behavior that I wouldn't accept from my banker, stock broker or lawyer, I'm going to stop giving them my money. When a company lies, cheats and steals, I'm not going to give them a pass because they are popular. When a company continually uses bait-and-switch tactics (No really! This version is going to be secure. We promise this time!) I'm going to switch to something else. I will do this because I believe that ethics aren't just something you do while in church or while people are watching."

Look. When Microsoft makes a product that is open, fully documented and stable, I'll consider overlooking their past activities. When Microsoft straightens up and starts behaving like an honest company, I'll go back to supporting them. Until then, I'm not interested in their products and I'll continue to point out their lies and deceptions.

If you want to let Microsoft lock up your code, be my guest. But let's not have any whining when .NET goes the way of VisualInterDev. (Remember that?)

[DallasMike]

No. I won't trust you. And I won't trust Microsoft either.

You're just a bundle of joy and I bet you have lots of friends. Not.

Your answer also indicates that you don't have a clue as to how .NET makes the distribution and maintenance of software a couple of orders of magnitude easier than it was under COM. It's already making my job a whole lot more pleasant and it will be even better once we're finished converting all of our apps.

Stick solely with Linux or whatever you like. Those of us who are more adaptable will be just that much more employable.

[Knitebane]

Your answer also indicates that you don't have a clue as to how .NET makes the distribution and maintenance of software a couple of orders of magnitude easier than it was under COM.

Easier != better.

With Microsoft even better != better. After all of the fiascos of the past, everytime I see an ad for Microsoft with the word "better" in it, my first question is, "Better for whom?"

And if you dig deep enough, the answer is usually not the end user.