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To: Gritty
Whatever happened to the police politely knocking on the door, showing the warrant and doing a search without terrorizing everybody in sight?

Simple. Several of them got blown away by drug dealers who, having heard the knock and the words, "Police! We have a warrant!" promptly picked up their favorite pieces, put themselves in a good position, and shot the cops either through the door or as they were coming in.

Look, I agree that it sucks that these cops terrorized this family, and I think whoever screwed up the operation needs to be busted for it (I also think they have a right to know who fingered them for drug dealers), but try thinking it through before you assume that the cops come on fully armed and with overwhelming force just for the power rush. They do it so that the other guy doesn't have the chance to even think about firing back, making it safer for all concerned, both them and the suspects.

88 posted on 05/23/2003 5:49:12 PM PDT by Buggman (Stephen King has forgotten the face of his Father)
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To: Buggman
"They do it so that the other guy doesn't have the chance to even think about firing back, making it safer for all concerned, both them and the suspects."

So when they do finally get the "wrong" address some day, and it's one of the 2nd Amendment FReeper loving NRA types and 3 or 4 officers get wasted and the innocent subject does too, what will you say to their families? Oops? So Sorry? Here's 10 million bucks and shut up? The problem is that the warrants and bad no-knocks are just plain lazy. Intel is where police lack and it's being proven every day with these latest incidents.
91 posted on 05/23/2003 5:56:37 PM PDT by Beck_isright (When Senator Byrd landed on an aircraft carrier, the blacks were forced below shoveling coal...)
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To: Buggman
Look, I agree that it sucks that these cops terrorized this family

They were not cops, cops are useful, these were just revenue agents out for a piece of the action.

Why do you think a percentage of what they collect goes to their budgets?

94 posted on 05/23/2003 6:10:57 PM PDT by Mark was here
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To: Buggman
Several of them got blown away by drug dealers who, having heard the knock and the words, "Police! We have a warrant!" promptly picked up their favorite pieces, put themselves in a good position, and shot the cops either through the door or as they were coming in.

Hmmm, something that never used to happen in the days before criminalization of drugs. It's not that life was so much better then, it's just that in addition to having addicts we now have drug cartels living off the users and cops and politicians and anti-drug programs like D.A.R.E. living off the drug cartels. All the rest of the bad stuff was caused, not by the drugs, but by the criminalization of them. The party responsible for this is Congress.
96 posted on 05/23/2003 6:14:51 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: Buggman
try thinking it through before you assume that the cops come on fully armed and with overwhelming force just for the power rush

I don't assume at all they do this for the "power rush". No doubt it makes the door bashers feel a lot safer. But, what about the innocent citizens?

My problem is, today it's OK to do it for all drug busts, tomorrow it may be for parking tickets or failure to appear. After all, it is always easiest (and safest) to assume there is armed menace lurking just inside every door.

Look. I'm no fan of drug dealers. But there has to be some sort of proportionality here. Where does this stop?

"It can't happen here", you say? Well, how about the practice of "forfeiture", which is clearly an unConstitutional "taking"? It started small, and now practically funds entire police departments. It started with "drugs" and now people are losing their expensive cars over such things as soliciting prostitutes. You are assumed guilty unless you can prove yourself innocent. That sure isn't American Constitutional Law, although it may be today's jurisprudence.

The abuse of civil liberties tends to accelerate in direct relationship to the "requirement" for safety. Pick any Amendment and try it on for size. You'll find they are all eroded this way.

Similarly, there are more than enough of these dangerous and even deadly incidents of "mistaken identity" happening nowadays. Police departments should only use these techniques when there is a demonstrated threat, not when the case is full of "might be's", much less wrong addresses!

Sure. Policing is a dangerous business. Increasingly, so is being an innocent citizen.

97 posted on 05/23/2003 6:18:32 PM PDT by Gritty
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To: Buggman
They do it so that the other guy doesn't have the chance to even think about firing back, making it safer for all concerned, both them and the suspects.

Must be why they used the grenade on the heart attack victim.

136 posted on 05/24/2003 10:18:47 AM PDT by American in Israel (Right beats wrong)
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To: Buggman
Good theory, but.... the F' ups like this seem to happen a lot more often than not (at least as far as we know).
175 posted on 05/26/2003 3:20:33 PM PDT by j_tull (Keep the Shiny Side UP!)
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