Are you a Thiemite, CV?
Posted on 08/30/2003 5:48:16 PM PDT by xzins
This is anything BUT common Grace..read it please...
1Cr 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
This clearly says that all men do not have the grace necessary to understand the Gospel
Jhn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Another fine Calvinist proof text. This clearly says that all men do not have the grace to come , only those that the Father gives it to.
2Cr 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
2Cr 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
One more that proves that there is no common grace that allows dead-men to save themselves
Consider the words. The gospel is hid from some men , all men can not see it because their minds are blinded. Common grace will not allow this blind man to see.
Calvinists also love romans
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind [is] enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Read this..again it clearly indicates that common grace does not bring the dead to life .
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his
Note that common grace does not benefit all men , for some remain in the flesh . The Spirit does not indwell until after the man is saved.
"God, for reasons known only to himself, (cf. Matt. 11:25–26) gives an inward, effectual call, in addition to the outward invitation, to the elect in Christ. This inward call is accompanied with the very power of God (cf. Eph. 1:19–20), and with it comes a new birth, life, willingness (cf. Psalms 110:3) to look unto Christ, and a desire to love and obey him. This results in a new nature, one that is now in willing subservience to Christ, a nature that is no longer in bondage to the prince of this world. With the new nature comes the ability to receive the truth of the gospel. Thus the "born of the Spirit" (cf. John 3:7–8) sinner freely and willingly turns to Christ as Lord and Savior. The Spirit of God gives faith and repentance to this child of God"
Jacob Moseley.
I'm more inclined to say that it was predestined that I should eventually grow weary of that particular debate. :P
Perhaps...:o)
I find this to be some fairly good notetaking on the doctrine of the Blood of Christ.
1. Background.
a. Blood was recognized in and outside the Bible as the seat of physical life, hence the axiomatic statement "For the life of the flesh is in the blood" (Lev.17:11; cp. Gen.9:4).
b. Consequently, the shedding of blood and blood itself (when outside the body) are used figuratively to represent death, whether via capital punishment (Gen.9:5,6), war (1Kgs.2:5; 1Chr.28:3), murder (Gen.9:6; 37:22; 42:22; Num.19:10; 35:19,27,33), or sacrifice (Ex.12:7,13,22,23; Lev.17:11).
c. The term is also used figuratively to represent physical humanity (Mt.16:17; Jn.1:13; Gal.1:16), and guilt for a capital offense (Num.20:9,16,27; Josh.2:19; Mt.27:25).
2. Animal blood was used under the Old Testament shadow soteriology to portray Christ's spiritual death for sins (Lev.17; cp. Jn.1:29; Heb.9:7,12-14,18-21,25; 10:4,19,29; 12:24; 1Pet.1:18,20).
a. Christ's spiritual death was invisible to man.
b. Animals do not have souls or spirits, as people do. c. The blood of sacrificial animals (which represented their death) could not save (Heb.10:4), but was used as a visible representation of the spiritual death of Christ for sins, which the Levitical sacrifices foreshadowed.
i)The death of the victim is the key part of the sacrifice, not its blood (Lev.17:11 "for it is the blood by reason of the life that makes atonement").
ii) The blood of the sacrificial animals must be recognized as constituting a representative analogy to the spiritual death of Christ, the lesser representing the greater, the visible representing the invisible.
3. Various ritualistic uses of blood under "Codex 3" speak of doctrines related to Christ's work (Lev.17).
a. Blood applied to the horns (speaks of power) of the Altar teaches that the gospel is the power of God unto salvation.
b. Sprinkling blood on the Altar speaks of Christ propitiating the Godhead on the Cross.
c. Pouring the blood out at the base of the Altar portrays unlimited atonement.
d. Blood sprinkled on the Mercy Seat speaks of the impact of propitiation toward God (in the third heaven).
e. Blood on the right ear lobe, right thumb, and right toe speaks of the work of Christ as the basis for the grace apparatus for perception (GAP) and divine good production.
f. Blood on the horns of the Altar of Incense speaks of Christ's work as the authority behind prayer.
g. Sprinkling seven times (speaks of perfection) represents the perfect work of propitiation, which cannot be added to.
4. Christ actually died twice while on the Cross (Isa.53:9, "deaths").
a. Adam died twice: spiritually at the moment of his sin (Gen.3) and physically 960 years later (Gen.5).
b. Christ's spiritual death is designed to undo what Adam's negative volition got us into (Rom.5:19 "For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous"; also, cp. vv.13-21).
c. In time, Christ made a volitional decision to die spiritually (Lk.22:42, "Father...").
d. Christ's spiritual death took exactly three hours (Mk.14:33,34; Mt.27:45,46; Lk.23:44,45; Jn.19:28-30).
e. During those three hours He was judged for all sins, including the sins of unbelievers (2Cor.5:21; 1Jn.2:2).
f. His rhetorical question draws attention to the three hours (Mt.27:46 "MY GOD, MY GOD, WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME?").
g. Afterward, He said "It is finished", the perfect passive indicative of tele,w, teleo, referring to bearing our sins.
h. Finally, Christ died physically by His own volition (Lk.23:46 "Father, INTO YOUR HANDS I COMMIT MY SPIRIT").
5. Christ did not bleed to death on the Cross, nor does His physical bleeding save.
a. The witness of John (eyewitness; Jn.19:30-35).
b. Christ did bleed both before and after His deaths on the Cross (Gethsemane, Pilate's court, crucifixion, blood and serum).
c. Christ's sufferings fall into two categories: those inflicted by the cosmos, and those inflicted by God.
d. Only the latter was efficacious, and it did not include bleeding.
6. Synonyms for the blood of Christ.
a. Christ died for our sins (1Cor.15:3).
b. Christ bore our sins (1Pet.2:24).
c. Christ was made sin (2Cor.5:21).
7. "Eating" Christ's flesh and "drinking" His blood is analogous to the appropriation of salvation (Jn.6:53-56; some peeled off; they could not handle this analogy).
8. The blood of Christ portrays:
a. Propitiation (Rom.3:25; Heb.9:5).
b. Redemption (Eph.1:17; Col.1:14; 1Pet.1:18,19; Rev.1:5; lu,w, luo: release, cp. lou,w, louo: wash).
c. Reconciliation (Eph.2:13-17).
d. Sanctification (Heb.13:10-12).
e. Justification (Rom.5:9).
9. The blood of Christ is the basis for the Rebound technique (Lev.4,5; cp. 1Jn.1:7,9).
a. Believers continue to possess the sinful trend of Adam, and sin after salvation (1Jn.1:8,10 "If we say that we have no sin [nature], we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth [doctrine] is not in us"; "If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us").
b. The blood of Christ is the reason a believer can Rebound and receive instant forgiveness (1Jn.1:7,9 "the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin"; "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins...").
c. If the believer does not believe this principle, he will lack the confidence to Rebound effectively.
Cast:
********
New Bible Class Schedule:
Sunday
10:30 AM Service - Taught by R. B. Thieme IIITuesday
8:00 PM Bible class (beginning 9 September 2003)-
Video recording from the R. B. Thieme, Jr., video libraryThursday
7:30 PM Prayer Meeting
8:00 PM Bible class -
Video recording from the R. B. Thieme, Jr., video libraryPrep School and the Nursery will be available during all scheduled sessions.
The purpose of R. B. Thieme, Jr., Bible Ministries is to distribute the recorded and written material of R. B. Thieme, Jr. only. Therefore, recorded messages of R. B. Thieme III or subsequent speakers at Berachah Church will not be available.
******* Update to the Congregation from the Board of Deacons: At the August Board of Deacons Meeting, Pastor Robert B. Thieme III accepted an invitation to continue teaching Sunday morning classes for the month of September. In response to congregational interest, the Board of Deacons voted to add a Tuesday evening Bible class from the R. B. Thieme, Jr., video library. The first of these classes will be held on Tuesday, September 9th. Prep School will also resume on September 9th. The board is in the process of resolving various administrative and financial issues concerning our pastor. When these issues are finalized, the pulpit vacancy procedures will be implemented. We will continue to keep you updated on these matters.
This 'notetaking' can be found at the Maranatha Church Website.
I asked you a simple "yes or no" question, and you give us a data dump, cut and pasted from a website you didn't even have the honesty to give credit to. Did you think we would assume that you wrote this? Do you think we're all that dumb?
There is much in these so-called "notes" that is unscriptural, and I see a couple places where the author added (in brackets) words that alter the clear meaning of the verse to try to make it say what he wanted it to say. Downright dishonest if you ask me. I will deal with every one of these items when I have the time, because this subject is of vital importance to the Believer. Do not take the delay for lack of knowledge.
Now then, there is some unfinished business between us. In order for any doctrinal discussion to progress between us, it must be dealt with. There are many people watching to see what you will do, who wonder if you are all wind and no substance, who wonder if you possess the "spirituality" that you profess. The time is now, the place is here, and the person who is on the spot is you. No evasion, no prevarication, just plain, simple one and two-syllable words are all that are necessary, with no justification of yourself, no attempts to deflect or to avoid. Ignoring it or not answering will be seen as an admission that you can't bring yourself to correct yourself where you have erred, and cannot admit fault, and that you wrongfully accused me and impuned my salvation and my standing before God. You know what the right thing to do is. Will you do it?
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