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To: LPM1888
Tell me where I am wrong. Do you not wish to tax me to pay the teachers who think they can substitute their judgment for mine as to what my kids should be taught and whether they should be using birth control or getting abortions behind the backs of my wife and me as parents?

My kids, like all kids, are fully free to decide (once they are self-supporting and of age) what they believe. How could it be otherwise? One can cage the body but not the mind.

A Manhattan Project for software for public schools???? Aren't we making enough leftist millionares already via that system?

While it is true that I am free to home school, or privately school my kids at my expense (Thank you, old SCOTUS for the 1927 decsion of Pierce vs. The Society of Sisters, the Magna Carta of freedom from mandatory government indoctrination of children), Jefferson observed that taking money from a citizen to promote ideas which he hates is a very high form of tyranny and one which Heinlein likely would have resisted with Jefferson.

Government institutions ought to be majoritarian at the very least. Despite the statistics in your family or mine, the Roman Catholic Church is the largest in the US with 28% of the population (not counting "illegal" Mexicans). Southern Baptist Convention is next with 15%. Their social issue views are remarkably similar to Cathlic views. I don't know the numbers but the Missouri and Wisconsin synods of the Lutheran Church are in agreement on those issues and significant in number. Evangelical Christians, many Pentecostal Christians, Orthodox Jews, Westminster Presbyterians, "Good News" Methodists, many Episcopalians who rebel against the enrenched money power of leftists in their church, Mormons, many Muslims, even some atheists, agnostics and libertarians. The list goes on and on but we are farmed for ideas we despise.

I want no government money for private or parochial schools lest inevitable strings be attached. I don't want government schools to be paid out of taxes either. there should be a level playing field.

174 posted on 10/07/2003 6:30:08 PM PDT by BlackElk (Schwarzenegger is as Republican as Pete Wilson or George McGovern or Hillary!!!)
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To: BlackElk
Tell me where I am wrong. Do you not wish to tax me to pay the teachers who think they can substitute their judgment for mine as to what my kids should be taught and whether they should be using birth control or getting abortions behind the backs of my wife and me as parents?

The problem with your logic is that all of us have different ideas about most things. You will never find any school or teacher who matchs your ideas completely. Although you may be capable of succesfully home-schooling your children or paying for a private school or tutor most people aren't. If we were all to decide to quit paying for public schools America would cease to exist within a single generation.

Don't interpret that statement to mean that home-schooling shouldn't be legal. My youngest son was home-schooled, not because of any religous concerns, because of educational concerns. We were living in Florida and the school system there is horrible. The citizens of Florida have cut the funding for the schools to the point that it was pointless for him to waste three years of his life just to jump through their hoops. Home-schooling should be the option of last resort not the first.

My kids, like all kids, are fully free to decide (once they are self-supporting and of age) what they believe. How could it be otherwise? One can cage the body but not the mind.

I agree but that doesn't mean you have the right to assign them and their children to a life of poverty (and subsistence on the public dole) if they err and become pregnant.

A Manhattan Project for software for public schools???? Aren't we making enough leftist millionares already via that system?

This isn't about making anyone a millionaire, this is about finding a way to provide our children with an optimal education. The best game programmers are already becoming millionaires, we won't be able to hire them cheaply.

While it is true that I am free to home school, or privately school my kids at my expense (Thank you, old SCOTUS for the 1927 decsion of Pierce vs. The Society of Sisters, the Magna Carta of freedom from mandatory government indoctrination of children), Jefferson observed that taking money from a citizen to promote ideas which he hates is a very high form of tyranny and one which Heinlein likely would have resisted with Jefferson.

Heinlein was a very strong advocate of getting an education. I know of no instances where he spoke out against a public school system.

A generation, which ignores history, has no past and no future. -- Lazarus Long

Anyone who cannot cope with mathematics is not fully human. At best he is a tolerable subhuman who has learned to wear shoes, bathe, and not make messes in the house. -- Lazarus Long

Government institutions ought to be majoritarian at the very least. Despite the statistics in your family or mine, the Roman Catholic Church is the largest in the US with 28% of the population (not counting "illegal" Mexicans). Southern Baptist Convention is next with 15%. Their social issue views are remarkably similar to Cathlic views. I don't know the numbers but the Missouri and Wisconsin synods of the Lutheran Church are in agreement on those issues and significant in number. Evangelical Christians, many Pentecostal Christians, Orthodox Jews, Westminster Presbyterians, "Good News" Methodists, many Episcopalians who rebel against the enrenched money power of leftists in their church, Mormons, many Muslims, even some atheists, agnostics and libertarians. The list goes on and on but we are farmed for ideas we despise.

America is a Republic for very good reasons. It insures that the mass of the majority cannot lead to a pure Democracy. Without that insight by our Founding Fathers the American Experiment would have ended in a Dictatorship long ago. This has been discussed in depth on this Forum many many times.

I want no government money for private or parochial schools lest inevitable strings be attached. I don't want government schools to be paid out of taxes either. there should be a level playing field.

It sounds good in theory but in practice 90% of the children would never receive an education of any kind and America would collapse within a generation. There are certain obligations that we all share as the inheritors of this great country. Secondary to providing a national defense, insuring that those who follow us have the opportunity for an education is the most important obligation of all.

175 posted on 10/09/2003 6:14:18 PM PDT by LPM1888 ("It's about governance. It's not about sermons." Brooks Firestone)
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To: BlackElk
Here is a comment in a thread that I thought you might be interested in, pay particular attention to the last two paragraphs.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/997715/posts?page=474#474
176 posted on 10/09/2003 6:47:36 PM PDT by LPM1888 ("It's about governance. It's not about sermons." Brooks Firestone)
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