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To: Canticle_of_Deborah
I found this statement from Bob Sungenis that seems to support the Feenyite postition regarding "no salvation outside the Church."

R. Sungenis: Now, why might Catholic Answers take such a liberal position on the question of evangelism? Because that is what inevitably happens when one begins to water down the doctrine of “no salvation outside the church.” Inevitably, “invincible ignorance” is made into the rule rather than the exception. Despite the fact that “no salvation outside the Church” was elevated to Catholic dogma by at least three popes and confirmed by about a dozen others, in addition to being upheld by a consensus of Fathers, saints and doctors of the Church, Catholic Answers, and similar apostolates today, have found themselves in the unending quest to find the least common denominator in the downward spiral of modern ecumenical Catholicism. Rather than preaching the time-honored truth of salvation only within the Catholic Church, they go out of their way to invent excuses for those who are the slightest bit offended by Catholicism, teaching that they can also find salvation in their own religions. Sadly, the “invincible ignorance” addendum of Pius IX has been turned into the wax nose of modern Catholics like Keating who, along with a number of liberal clerics, have gone way beyond Pius IX’s intentions, and they do so to their own peril.

123 posted on 03/14/2004 1:45:44 PM PST by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Aquinasfan
Thanks for the interesting link.

The doctrine of "no salvation outside the Catholic Church" is not Feenyite. It was taught by Popes and doctors of the Church up until Vatican II. Feeney's error was in rejecting baptism of desire, not adhering to 'no salvation outside the Church'.

Keating is supporting the post Vatican II supposition that it is not necessary to convert to Catholicism or even Christianity to be saved.

I don't see a problem with Sungenis' response. He is more hardline than I am, but his belief is 100% in agreement with the pre VII Church.
132 posted on 03/14/2004 3:00:25 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: Aquinasfan; Canticle_of_Deborah
I found this statement from Bob Sungenis that seems to support the Feenyite postition regarding "no salvation outside the Church."

Oh cut it out! The Catholic Church is unanimous in it's doctrine.

The last I knew the question of Salvation outside the (RC) Church is doctrine. Isn't it?

Now if you'll just explain if Unum Sanctum is doctrine or not.

137 posted on 03/14/2004 3:21:49 PM PST by OLD REGGIE ((I am a cult of one! UNITARJEWMIAN) Maybe a Biblical Unitarian?)
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To: Aquinasfan; Canticle_of_Deborah
Come now, you are expanding the definition of Feeneyism. Even the Cathechism would be Feenyite by that definition. Feeney's problem was what he taught about Baptism of Desire and Baptism by Blood, but he was excommunicated for disobedience, and for private interpretation of Scripture. Basically, Certain issues about salvation have not been setlled infallibly by the Church. There is a range of opinions within the Church, the one can hold without out being outside the bounds of Church teaching. So, one can hold a few different positions on salvation, but you van't claim that that interpretation is the only one taught by the Church.
172 posted on 03/15/2004 2:17:11 AM PST by nickcarraway
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