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To: kosta50; Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; Cronos; annalex; HarleyD; Gamecock
So, we must then conclude that He really didn't care for the very people He created in the Garden of Eden. In other words, God made rejects.

I wouldn't conclude that any more than I would conclude the angelic host had flaws with the fall of Satan and 1/3 of the angels. God wasn't surprise by them leaving and He certainly wasn't surprise by Adam and Eve. God made them exactly as He intended and they fell just as He intended.

While there is no clear reference to the election of Adam and Eve, many commentators (and I believe many church fathers) have always held Adam and Eve to have been saved. They base this upon the following verses:

Though weak, many people interpret the statement “clothed them” to be symbolic of God covering our sins.

So God has authority to force us to love Him? The authority to change our minds and our hearts? That's love, right?

Of course it is. Don’t you try to change the hearts and minds of your kids? You do this because you love them and know what’s best for them, don’t you? If they paint the neighbor's car or jump off a roof don't you have a stern talking to them. Why? Because you love them and you don't wish to see them hurt themselves. You’re just not always successful at changing their hearts and you’re not always right about the reason you want to change their hearts. God, OTOH is ALWAYS 100% successful at changing hearts and lives.

What your real gripe is, is simply that God doesn’t do this for everyone. This is incomprehensible to your Greek thought process. Instead you would rather rationalize that God offers everyone, everything and only a few accept His offer. Sorry. This isn’t the God of scripture. He makes choices and does what He pleases. And everything is perfectly right, holy and just regardless of what we think.

2,628 posted on 02/14/2006 6:39:44 AM PST by HarleyD ("Man's steps are ordained by the LORD, How then can man understand his way?" Prov 20:24)
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To: HarleyD; kosta50; Forest Keeper; Cronos; annalex; Gamecock
"What your real gripe is, is simply that God doesn’t do this for everyone. This is incomprehensible to your Greek thought process. Instead you would rather rationalize that God offers everyone, everything and only a few accept His offer. Sorry. This isn’t the God of scripture. He makes choices and does what He pleases. And everything is perfectly right, holy and just regardless of what we think."

Harley, 2 Peter 3 says:

"The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance."

More cosmic game playing, Harley, or does +Peter know something Calvinists don't? Maybe Peter was just a Greek and without the inspiration of God or the influence of clearly superior 16th century Western European understanding of God? Poor +Peter, if only he'd been born in Geneva he might not have fallen into such error!

2,651 posted on 02/14/2006 5:45:13 PM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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