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To: kosta50
the Protestants, even though they are faithful and loving Christians, are unfortunately not part of the Church (and this is not meant as an insult, so please do not take it that way).

So many of your positions are approaching the absurd....

First -- nowhere in Biblical Scripture is the word "church" capitalized. The original ekklesia (Strong's G1577) infers those gathered in like mind and heart more than a formal organization or gathering.

The church is a living organism -- the Body of Christ -- so much, much more than a religious organization.

All disciples of Christ are part of the Body of Christ....
If that excludes some from your "organization", well so be it.

There are many who will be shouting "Lord, Lord..."
And our Master will say to those very religious folks: "Go away - I never KNEW you"

For someone who constantly makes snide remarks and sneers at sincere followers of Christ concerning the use of "your Christian Bible" -- I suggest you read it from cover to cover.

I also strongly suggest you repent of your arrogant but ignorant religiosity -- and seek first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness --

Thence to see if at least your perspective towards your kindred in the Lord -- if not your entire life of faith -- might change.

159 posted on 11/16/2006 3:43:11 PM PST by Wings-n-Wind (All of the answers remain available; Wisdom is gained by asking the right questions!)
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To: Wings-n-Wind; kosta50
nowhere in Biblical Scripture is the word "church" capitalized

The entire Greek original has no capitalization, not even for personal names.

All disciples of Christ are part of the Body of Christ

Do you disagree that that body is formed through baptism? Because every time a conversion is described in he scripture, the convert is immediately baptized.

Do you disagree that through one's actions one can leave the Church? Examples are Simon Magus, Hymeneus and Alexander (1 Timothy 1), Ananias and Saphira (Acts 5), and we have to assume many more, as St. Paul in 2 Timothy complains that most have left him.

163 posted on 11/16/2006 4:47:00 PM PST by annalex
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To: Wings-n-Wind
So many of your positions are approaching the absurd....

I wish you'd mention which "so many" so we can establish how absurd they are. If you mean the underlined section, namely that the Protestants are not part of the Church, then I beg to differ with you.

This was not meant as an insult, and I made that abundantly clear. Nor was it meant to question their faith. I question no one's faith. But, you will have to consider a historical fact that followers of Luther left the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, the only Church (which is why it is capitalized) we know that was established by our Lord Jesus Christ in Person.

Aside from the historical aspect of this being outside of the Church, it is clear that the Church considers Protestants as "separated brethren" even though, by virtue of their Baptism (those that are Trinitarian) they are still Catholic, even if their practices are not.

The Church considers Protestant churches as Christian "assemblies" and "communities" that are outside the Church. And, the Orthodox Church does also.

So, if there is anything "absurd" in all this, it is not "mine" and it is not even absurd.

For someone who constantly makes snide remarks and sneers at sincere followers of Christ concerning the use of "your Christian Bible" -- I suggest you read it from cover to cover

Obviously you are not aware that Luther changed the Christian canon. His ambition was to do a lot more damage than he did. But one thing he certainly did accomplish and that was to switch ti the Hebrew-language OT canon rather than the OT quoted by the Apostles (in over 95% of the cases), which is the Septuagint (or LXX).

So, to be honest with you, we do NOT read the same Bible. There is nothing snide about it. You are just being introduced to some realities which you were not aware of, and which are fully verifiable.

To see how different the two Bibles really can be, consider Isaiah 9:6

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" [KJV]

"For a Child is born to us, and a Son is given to us, whose government is upon His shoulder; and His name is called The Messenger of Great Counsel; for I will bring peace upon the princes, and health to Him." [LXX]

Clearly, someone's fingers have been in some of these verses, don't you think? The two verses are unrecognizable!

And what about, moving on just two verses down, Isa 9:8

"The Lord sent a word into Jacob, and it hath lighted upon Israel" [KJV]

"The Lord has sent death upon Jacob, and it has come upon Israel." [LXX]

Reads like two different books, doesn't it?

I also strongly suggest you repent of your arrogant but ignorant religiosity -- and seek first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness --

Now, that is personal. You are calling my religiosity "ignorant" and "arrogant." Why? To which I simply say: please prove it now that you qualified it.

168 posted on 11/16/2006 8:20:49 PM PST by kosta50 (Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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