Schismatic bishop calls Motu Propio on 1962 Missal historic "leap"

CNA ^ | July 12, 2007

[NYer]

Madrid, Jul 12, 2007 / 10:30 am (CNA).- In an exclusive interview with the Spanish daily “La Razon,” the superior general of the Lefebvrites, Bishop Bernard Fellay, said Benedict XVI’s Motu Propio allowing universal use of the Missal of 1962 as an extraordinary form of celebrating the Mass “is not a step, it’s a leap” of historic proportions.

The schismatic bishop spoke with journalist Vittorio Messori from the general house of the Priestly Fraternity of St. Pius X, founded by the late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre. The movement boasts of 481 priests, 90 lay brothers, 206 nuns, 6 seminaries, 117 monasteries, 82 schools, 6 university institutes, 450 places of worship in 62 countries and at least half a million followers.

According to La Razon, Fellay’s reactions are “more positive than what anyone who knows the complexity of the ongoing case with the Holy See for more than 20 years could have expected: the Mass, not only in Latin, but according to the ancient rite, has always been the rallying cry of the Lefebvrists.  But dissidents have always insisted on the fact that the new Eucharistic liturgy is nothing more than the expression of an orientation that is unacceptable in many aspects, adopted after Vatican II by the Catholic Church.

Thus, in certain traditionalist circles, it has often been said that a decree such as the one approved by Pope Ratzinger would not only be insufficient, but would in some way be a distraction and would reinforce the ambiguities.”

Nevertheless, Fellay said, “This is a truly historic day.  We desire to express our profound gratitude to Benedict XVI.   His document is a gift of Grace.  It’s not a step; it’s a leap in the right direction.”

In addition, Fellay said the “normalization” of the Mass, “which does not belong to St. Pius VI but rather has always belonged to the Church,” is “an act of justice, it’s a supernatural extraordinary help in times of grave ecclesial crisis.”

“The reaffirmation by the Holy Father of the continuity of Vatican II and the new Mass with the constant Tradition of the Church moves us to continue the doctrinal discussion.  ‘Lex orandi, lex credendi’: as one prays, so one believes.  And now it has been recognized that in the eternal Mass, one can ‘adequately’ pray,” Fellay said.

“This document is a fundamental stage in a journey that now could be accelerated,” he noted, saying he hoped as well it would lead to a revisiting of the issue of the excommunications put in place by John Paul II.

According to Messori, the effort to recover the Church’s tradition, “initiated by John Paul II, although constrained to the obligatory excommunication, takes on noble success with Benedict XVI, in the perspective of the old Ratzinger project of a ‘reform of the reform,’ and not only of the ancient liturgy.”

[Youngstown]

Here are some resources on the above topics:

Photocopy of Abp. Thuc's 1981 Handwritten Latin Consecration Certificate of Bp. Moises Carmona Rivera

Photocopy of Letter by SSPX Bp. Williamson Admitting the Validity of the Thuc Consecrations - but hypocritically questioning the necessity for such and hence the licity.

1982 Declaration of Abp. Ngo Dinh Thuc on the Vacancy of the Holy See

Bp. Moises Carmona Rivera's 1982 Defense of His 1981 Episcopal Consecration by Abp. Thuc

[NYer]

I finally found a copy of my 1961 St. Joseph’s Daily Missal (got for my First Communion) that has never been used! Still in the box! White leather, just like mine.

What a coincidence! Only recently, I came across my St. Joseph's Daily Missal, in white leather. I also found my 1971 Missal. I immediately searched for the Prayer for the Jews on Good Friday in both missals.

Knowing that my Maronite pastor is fluent in Latin and bi-ritual (Latin Rite), and that the RC bishop will soon be convening a meeting of diocesan priests (my pastor often attends even though he is held accountable to his own Maronite bishop), I showed the 2 versions of those prayers to him today. Wish I had written down the prayer from the older missal. It begins with a prayer "for the faithless Jews". He was so stunned that he laughed (he is also fluent in Hebrew). He then read the same Good Friday prayer in the 1971 missal which is considerably toned down.

He then proceeded to seriously read out, loud, the Latin text of the Mass from the St. Joseph's missal and tried to explain it to me. Before he could, I gave the Latin responses ;-) and challenged him to imagine one of our Maronite altar servers having to memorize these lengthy responses in Latin. At that point, we both had a good laugh, since the Maronite liturgy places few demands on the acolytes, other than to bring the priest the incenser and incense boat, etc. All responses in the Maronite Divine Liturgy come from the congregation, and are chanted.

Given the small number of RC priests within the Albany Diocese who are familiar with Latin, I am curious to see if Bishop Hubbard will 'avail' himself of the services of this Maronite Catholic priest, who is fluent in the language. It naturally raises a host of questions. Would the TLM be celebrated in our small Church? If so, would Father be required to move the altar back? What about acolytes? Would he be responsible for training them in Latin and from where would they come? And ... what about vestments? He only has 2 sets of Maronite vestments (and is in desperate need of more) and 2 sets of NO vestments but no Tridentine ones. Ahhhh .... life in the RC Diocese of Albany. I will keep you all posted :-)

[NYer]

there’s a feeling that this might prompt seminaries (here in Spain) to start stressing Latin again and to be more demanding and orthodox in their instruction in general.

Ultimately, I belive that is the bottom line purpose of Pope Benedict XVI in unleashing the TLM. Word on the street is that he will soon issue a 2nd 'motu proprio' banning illicit practices from the NO Mass.

[Miles the Slasher]

“...Word on the street is that he will soon issue a 2nd ‘motu proprio’ banning illicit practices from the NO Mass...”

Good news if so. Any for instances? Sources?

[NYer]

Any for instances? Sources?

Yes ... Diogenes who runs a blog at Catholic News Service.

[Frank Sheed]

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[Frank Sheed]

The M.P. says that ONE TLM may be said at each PARISH on any given Sunday (unless the Parish is one of the TLM apostolic societies in which more can be offered). ANY priest can say the Mass “in private” and ANY parishioner can attend. So, if Fr. A wants to say a “private” TLM Mass on Sunday at 1:00 after other Masses are over, 3,890 parishioners can attend if they wish.

IF a “stable group” (no number stated) attends these Masses, Fr. A can ask his Pastor to allow the TLM to be said each Sunday. If grief is received, the PARISHIONERS CAN PETITION THE Ecclesia Dei “storm troopers” who will take over and ask the Bishop to intervene on the PARISHIONERS’ BEHALF.

I am not in the A.D. of D.C. but I am on a mailing list emanating from there. I am in receipt of an email that one site is going to offer one TLM each DAY starting September 15th. I can’t confirm that. This is what is in the offing.

If you want it, ask for it, go to it, insist on it.

F

[Frank Sheed]

http://dailymotion.alice.it/video/x1o9as_la-metamorphose-dun-autel

In the category of “where there is a will, there is a way.”

The M.P. does not say that the TLM MUST be celebrated ad orientem. I know that sounds heretical, but it could be said “versus populum,” I imagine, if the site is impossible to use with a “high altar”.

Wait for more info. And yes, a Latin speaking priest in Albany could be a major draw for faith-starved Catholics fed up with liberalism. It only takes Father’s will and God’s will to see where this leads. He might find a bright seminarian or an old altar boy [who still has the “little red book” with all the Low Mass responses memorized] who can pinch hit in the Latin responses.

[Palladin]

Thank you for the clarification.

[Frank Sheed]

I just got another email stating that so many priests in the A.D. of Arlington want to say the TLM that Bishop Loverde is going to coordinate training efforts with the F.S.S.P. some of whom are in that Diocese.

[sneakers]

I found this link posted on another board. Hugh Hewitt, conservative talk show host, and guests, Fr. Joseph Fessio and
David Allen White.

http://www.townhall.com/TalkRadio/Show.aspx?RadioShowID=5&ContentGuid=0150842c-31f3-4617-a47c-66c1057cd0d3

Interesting and uplifting interview! You can hear their joy and excitement over the Motu Proprio!

[Smocker]

Schismatic bishop calls Motu Propio on 1962 Missal historic "leap" CNA ^ | July 12, 2007

What Vatican document has named and declared Bishop Fellay as a Schismatic, have you got any idea?

Thanks.

[Smocker]

Great link, looking forward to listening to interview!!

thanks.

[Palladin]

Excellent!

I would like to approach my pastor about it, but he is in ill health and in a wheelchair. (Yes, he comes to Mass every Sunday, and though he cannot concelebrate, he does give Communion to everyone).

My Bishop—not so much. He refuses to silence a particularly heretical priest over in the next parish. I don’t think he will be going with the Latin Mass too soon, unless coerced.

[Frank Sheed]

You might wish to approach a young priest nearby who may be interested in learning to read the TLM Mass. If one priest begins to say the Mass “privately,” the ball begins to roll. Also, see this:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1865271/posts?page=12#12

[Cheverus]

You are correct, I was in error.

I checked out his website after the fact and found pictures of his Santay consecration.

[Cheverus]

I actually met one of the original 9. After he did a stint for Manslaughter and left a Church out in the midwest under a cloud after it was rumored he had an affair with a parishioner and forced her to have an abortion.

He was in West Roxbury, MA, until the Secretary for Cannonical affairs notified the indie Chapel and he disappeared again.

[old republic]

The M.P. does not say that the TLM MUST be celebrated ad orientem. I know that sounds heretical, but it could be said “versus populum,” I imagine, if the site is impossible to use with a “high altar”.

I would presume that the Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificum does not explicitly say that the TLM must be celebrated ad orientem because the Missal already requires it. The Motu Proprio does require the Missal of 1962 to be followed, and I believe that this Missal is specific about the priests orientation during mass.

[Frank Sheed]

I presume you are correct of course. I read this “caveat” in regards to the situation in which a local Ordinary had happily engaged in “wreckovation” to the point where there is no local Church or Chapel with a central tabernacle, high altar or altar rail. I guess it was said in that context.

This link below shows the “French” solution. It demonstrates that where there is a will, there is a way.

http://dailymotion.alice.it/video/x1o9as_la-metamorphose-dun-autel

Cheers!
Frank