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To: MarkBsnr
Jesus chose individuals to fulfill the offices of the Church. All Christians are exhorted to act Christian, yet not all are called to be Apostles and Church leaders.

Oh, so true. The only men called to be apostles were the original 12 and Paul.

All the rest are called to be disciples of Christ. That is the outward call, to the entire world so that no man is without excuse. The inward call, by the work of the indwelling Holy Spirit through unmerited grace alone, goes to all those who have been born again, who have received new ears and new eyes and a new heart and a renewed mind. Those men will respond in faith because it is the will of God that they do so.

"For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth" -- Romans 9:11

not all fulfill Church offices.

Certainly. Christ discusses various vocations, but throughout John, as we've seen, Christ is addressing all His disciples who believe in His name.

Maybe you should read John again so you could understand that better. If you believe the book of John is addressed only to the clergy, no wonder you overlook so much.

5,402 posted on 06/13/2008 11:12:12 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

***The only men called to be apostles were the original 12 and Paul.

All the rest are called to be disciples of Christ. That is the outward call, to the entire world so that no man is without excuse.***

Up to this point we agree. No man has an excuse - since the Grace of God is extended to all and all men are offered adoption.

***The inward call, by the work of the indwelling Holy Spirit through unmerited grace alone, goes to all those who have been born again, who have received new ears and new eyes and a new heart and a renewed mind. Those men will respond in faith because it is the will of God that they do so.***

Here we disagree, not on the working of Grace, but on those who accept versus those who do not accept.

1 Tim 2:

3
This is good and pleasing to God our savior,
4
who wills everyone to be saved and to come to knowledge of the truth.

Titus 2:
11
For the grace of God has appeared, saving all
12
and training us to reject godless ways and worldly desires and to live temperately, justly, and devoutly in this age,

John 3:
16
For God so loved the world that he gave 7 his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him might not perish but might have eternal life.
17
For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn 8 the world, but that the world might be saved through him.

Mark 16:
15
He said to them, “Go into the whole world and proclaim the gospel to every creature.
16
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved; whoever does not believe will be condemned.

We must hear and believe the gospel, repent of sin, confess Christ, and be baptized for forgiveness, after which we must live a faithful and Christian life. If we fall away, we can be forgiven if we truly repent and pray. 1 John 1:
8
If we say, “We are without sin,” we deceive ourselves, 3 and the truth is not in us.
9
If we acknowledge our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from every wrongdoing.

John speaks of Jesus alone in the room with the disciples. If you think that he was being rebroadcast to the world, that is your prerogative.


5,449 posted on 06/13/2008 12:39:24 PM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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