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To: kosta50
Yes, thank you for bringing that up. That is a very, very crucial difference indeed. There is no specific teaching or "dogma" in Judaism about afterlife, nor is there excessive preoccupation with it. As you said, Judaism is concerned with mostly this life, here and now, although it believes in afterlife.

Do not misunderstand--Judaism is a highly mystical and spiritual religion (though it has its rationalists). However, these doctrines are very esoteric. I am currently studying a book (two pages a day) on the Noachide Laws endorsed by authentic Orthodox rabbis. It begins by noting that "the righteous of the nations [which means pious observants of the Noachide Laws, not "all nice people"] have a portion in the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come," but after this focuses entirely on law, statute, and regulation. That is Judaism's exoteric systematic thrust.

Most Christians are not even remotely aware of this theological divide.

How many very sweet and sincere Judaeophilic "Bible chr*stians" know the important role of gilgul neshamot (ie, "reincarnation") in Orthodox Judaism? Of course, not all Orthodox Jews believe in it (it is rejected by the highly rationalistic).

I'm afraid I'll never understand classical chr*stianity. From my perspective as a Fundamentalist Protestant it simply makes no sense. Either we're messed up and and can only be passive recipients of salvation, or else the Law of G-d stands forever. But that we're "messed up" only enough to replace the Torah with something else? Um . . . illogical. As for the Catholic/classical Protestant argument over whether the "graces of the redemption" are "intrinsic or extrinsic," all I knew was that J*sus was vicariously damned in the place of each human individual, providing a loophole (you can't go to hell if you're already there!). This worldview makes Torah observance unnecessary, but it doesn't replace it with anything else and certainly isn't threatened if Jewish People continue to follow the commandments G-d gave them.

This view of chr*stianity which I held is, I believe, that of the vast majority in the American Heartland. Nothing is more confusing or makes less sense to one who holds such a view than authentic chr*stianity with its selective antinomianism.

All of this is not said as an insult to you or to anyone else but as a sincere attempt to explain how things look from my side.

27 posted on 07/31/2009 12:21:49 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (Shema` Yisra'el, HaShem 'Eloqeynu, HaShem 'Echad!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
Do not misunderstand--Judaism is a highly mystical and spiritual religion (though it has its rationalists). However, these doctrines are very esoteric.

Sadducees did not believe any of that as far as I know, and most of this mysticism is not biblical, or is it?

I am currently studying a book (two pages a day) on the Noachide Laws endorsed by authentic Orthodox rabbis. It begins by noting that "the righteous of the nations [which means pious observants of the Noachide Laws, not "all nice people"] have a portion in the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come," but after this focuses entirely on law, statute, and regulation. That is Judaism's exoteric systematic thrust.

I thought the life of the World to Come follows the Messianic Age as a mid-stage spiritual bliss, before the Great Judgment and the eternal World of Resurrection.

How many very sweet and sincere Judaeophilic "Bible chr*stians" know the important role of gilgul neshamot (ie, "reincarnation") in Orthodox Judaism? Of course, not all Orthodox Jews believe in it (it is rejected by the highly rationalistic).

I am willing to bet that most extreme Judaephillic Christians would find it acceptable. Most mainline Protetsants would not. They are simply still too "Catholic."  Of course, the Church flatly reject incarnation on the premise that the "self" would be lost and that we as individuals do not exist.

I'm afraid I'll never understand classical chr*stianity. From my perspective as a Fundamentalist Protestant...

When were you a Fundamentalist Protestant?

 But that we're "messed up" only enough to replace the Torah with something else?

It's not that simple...but that's another topic.

28 posted on 07/31/2009 6:01:09 PM PDT by kosta50 (Don't look up, the truth is all around you)
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