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Difficult Questions for Mormons
The Interactive Bible ^

Posted on 12/01/2010 6:28:46 PM PST by delacoert

  1. Why did the angel take Nephi Plates back to heaven? Do they not belong with man? Would not their existence prove once for all that Mormonism is truth? God allowed the Jews to carry the 10 commandments for several centuries in their original physical form, written by the finger of God Himself!
  2. "Will you, as a Mormon, please read the Bible cover to cover and ask God to reveal to you that it contains all of God's message to man and that parts are not lost or altered and that the Book of Mormon is false?"
  3. If the original 1830 Book of Mormon was inspired than why were there so many errors and changes and additions and deletions, when compared to current editions?
  4. How can we be assured that the translation of the B of M into French or any other language is correct? Only the English translation is claimed to be inspired!
  5. How do you account for the stunning parallels in both content and order between the B of M and the View of the Hebrews, by Ethan Smith? Published in 1823 (7 years before the B of M) less than 100 miles from the Joseph Smith's parents home.
  6. Mormon Article of Faith #8: "We Believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God." Why do you only add the phrase, "as far as it is translated correctly" to describe the Bible and not after the book of Mormon when in fact there are far more translating errors in the Book of Mormon than the Bible?
  7. If the Book of Mormon is true, then why has the Mormon church changed it? Examples are: 1 Nephi 11:21; 19:20; 20:1 and Alma 29:4. Compare these with the original Book of Mormon. (Gerald and Sandra Tanner have counted 3913 changes in the book of Mormon, excluding punctuation changes.)
  8. How did Joseph Smith carry home the golden plates of the Book of Mormon, and how did the witnesses lift them so easily? (They weighed about 230 lbs. Gold, with a density of 19.3 weighs 1204.7 lbs. per cubic foot. The plates were 7" x 8" by about 6". See Articles of Faith, by Talmage, page 262, 34th ed.)
  9. If Moroni devoutly practiced the Mormon Gospel, why is he an angel now rather than a God? (Doc. & Cov. 132:17,37)
  10. Why do Mormons emphasize part of the Word of Wisdom and ignore the part forbidding the eating of meat except in winter, cold or famine? (Doc. & Cov. 89:12,13).
  11. When Christ died, did darkness cover the land for three days or for three hours? (Luke 23:44 and 3 Nephi 8:19, 23).
  12. Joseph Smith said that there are men living on the moon who dress like Quakers and live to be nearly 1000 years old. Since he was wrong about the moon, is it safe to trust him regarding the way to Heaven? (The Young Woman's Journal, Vol. 3, pages 263-264. See repreint in Mormonism --Shadow or Reality? by Jerald and Sandra Tanner, page 4.)
  13. Joseph Smith prepared fourteen Articles of Faith. Why has the original No. 11 been omitted? (Joseph Smith Begins His Work, Vol. 2, three pages after page 160, among the photos.)
  14. Why did the Nauvoo House not stand forever and ever? (Doc. & Cov. 124:56-60).
  15. How can a man who is not a descendant of Aaron hold the Aaronic Priesthood? (Numbers 16:40; Heb. 7:13,14).
  16. Since Mormonism teaches that only God the Father had a physical body at the time Adam was created, why did God say, "Let us make man in OUR image"? Why didn't He say, "Let us make man in MY image?" (Gen. 1:26).
  17. If Jesus was conceived as a result of a physical union between God and Mary, how was Jesus born of a virgin? (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 1, page 50).
  18. How did Nephi with a few men on a new continent build a temple like Solomon's while Solomon needed 163,300 workmen and seven years to build his temple? (1 Kings 5:13-18 and 2 Nephi 5:15-17).
  19. Why was Joseph Smith still preaching against polygamy in October 1843 after he got his revelation in July 1843 commanding the practice of polygamy? (Doc. & Cov. 132; and History of the Church Vol. 6, page 46, or Teachings of the Prophet, page 324).
  20. God rejected the fig leaf aprons which Adam and Eve made (Gen. 3:21). Why do Mormons memorialize the fall by using fig leaf aprons in the secret temple ceremonies?
  21. How do you explain the fact that 2 Nephi 16:2 is copied from an older version of the KJV of the Bible in Isa 6:2? This is proven because this older KJV (the mistake is corrected in current versions) made a rare gramatical error by using the incorrect plural form of "seraphims" rather than "seraphim".


TOPICS: Other non-Christian
KEYWORDS: inmam; inman; lds; mormon
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To: nando9
It is even worse that you so comfortably deem any such witnesses as demonic.

Blame not me; but the BIBLE.

IT describes the visitation of the TWO Personages quite well.

I just merely point it out.

If one wants to believe they were NOT demons; who has convinced them of that?

101 posted on 12/04/2010 5:08:51 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: nando9
You place an inordinate amount of faith in physical proof of spiritual things.

OH?

And MORMONs place an inordinate amount of faith in LACK OF physical proof of anything MORMON.

WHY has their GOD hidden all these things that SHOULD be available to be found?

Citgies,
artifacts,
weaponry,
bones...

102 posted on 12/04/2010 5:11:23 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie

If it were the other way around, would your answer change?

<><><>><

LOL. What does your gut tell you?


103 posted on 12/04/2010 5:39:11 PM PST by dmz
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To: Elsie

By whose judgment “should” all these things be available to be found? Where in the Bible does it say, “This book is true because you can identify various historical places in it where the characters claim to have been.”

Here I thought the Bible was true because it was true, and not because you could vacation in Palestine.


104 posted on 12/04/2010 7:48:36 PM PST by nando9
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To: nando9
Here I thought the Bible was true because it was true, and not because you could vacation in Palestine.

The bible is neither true or false, as MEN describe it.

Men have made certain claims about it,and archeologial EVIKDENCE tends to back up those claims.

MEN have made certain claims about the BoM; but, there is NOTHING found in the record to back up those claims.


"In the beginning GOD...." is a claim.

MEN either 'believe' it or they do not, for, so far, nothing has been found in the 'record' to either prove or disprove it.

A few verses later, 4 rivers are mentioned. There are two rivers today that have those names, and the area around them have yield literally TONS of artifacts that speak to the FACT that things described in the bible were truly where it calaimed they were.

The bible has been used to FIND some places - the BoM cannot be 'used' to find anything.

105 posted on 12/05/2010 4:45:10 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: delacoert; Godzilla; Tennessee Nana; aMorePerfectUnion; P-Marlowe; Utah Binger; greyfoxx39; ...
22. WHY does the MORMON religious Corporation pictorally LIE about how the BoM was translated?

JS did NOT sit at a table, flipping the golden plates over, writing down the Reformed Egyptian® into 1611 English as he went; but stuffed his face into a HAT, and dictated words to one of his his stenographers, who wrote the words down.

106 posted on 12/05/2010 4:51:17 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie
 
 



"Now the way he translated was he put the urim and thummim into his hat and Darkned his Eyes than he would take a sentance and it would apper in Brite Roman Letters. Then he would tell the writer and he would write it. Then that would go away the next sentance would Come and so on. But if it was not Spelt rite it would not go away till it was rite, so we see it was marvelous. Thus was the hol [whole] translated."
---Joseph Knight's journal.


"In writing for your father I frequently wrote day after day, often sitting at the table close by him, he sitting with his face buried in his hat, with the stone in it, and dictating hour after hour with nothing between us."
(History of the RLDS Church, 8 vols.
(Independence, Missouri: Herald House,1951),
"Last Testimony of Sister Emma [Smith Bidamon]," 3:356.

"I, as well as all of my father's family, Smith's wife, Oliver Cowdery and Martin Harris, were present during the translation. . . . He [Joseph Smith] did not use the plates in translation."
---(David Whitmer,
as published in the "Kansas City Journal," June 5, 1881,
and reprinted in the RLDS "Journal of History", vol. 8, (1910), pp. 299-300.

In an 1885 interview, Zenas H. Gurley, then the editor of the RLDS Saints Herald, asked Whitmer if Joseph had used his "Peep stone" to do the translation. Whitmer replied:

"... he used a stone called a "Seers stone," the "Interpreters" having been taken away from him because of transgression. The "Interpreters" were taken from Joseph after he allowed Martin Harris to carry away the 116 pages of Ms [manuscript] of the Book of Mormon as a punishment, but he was allowed to go on and translate by use of a "Seers stone" which he had, and which he placed in a hat into which he buried his face, stating to me and others that the original character appeared upon parchment and under it the translation in English."


"Martin Harris related an incident that occurred during the time that he wrote that portion of the translation of the Book of Mormon which he was favored to write direct from the mouth of the Prophet Joseph Smith. He said that the Prophet possessed a seer stone, by which he was enabled to translate as well as from the Urim and Thummim, and for convenience he then used the seer stone, Martin explained the translation as follows: By aid of the seer stone, sentences would appear and were read by the Prophet and written by Martin and when finished he would say 'Written,' and if correctly written that sentence would disappear and another appear in its place, but if not written correctly it remained until corrected, so that the translation was just as it was engraven on the plates, precisely in the language then used."
(Edward Stevenson, "One of the Three Witnesses,"
reprinted from Deseret News, 30 Nov. 1881
in Millennial Star, 44 (6 Feb. 1882): 86-87.)

In 1879, Michael Morse, Emma Smith's brother-in-law, stated:
 
 "When Joseph was translating the Book of Mormon [I] had occasion more than once to go into his immediate presence, and saw him engaged at his work of translation. The mode of procedure consisted in Joseph's placing the Seer Stone in the crown of a hat, then putting his face into the hat, so as to entirely cover his face, resting his elbows upon his knees, and then dictating word after word, while the scribes Emma, John Whitmer, O. Cowdery, or some other wrote it down."
(W.W. Blair interview with Michael Morse,
Saints Herald, vol. 26, no. 12
June 15, 1879,  pp. 190-91.)


Joseph Smith's brother William also testified to the "face in the hat" version:
 
"The manner in which this was done was by looking into the Urim and Thummim, which was placed in a hat to exclude the light, (the plates lying near by covered up), and reading off the translation, which appeared in the stone by the power of God"
("A New Witness for Christ in America,"
Francis W. Kirkham, 2:417.)


"The manner in which he pretended to read and interpret was the same manner as when he looked for the money-diggers, with the stone in his hat, while the book of plates were at the same time hid in the woods."
---Isaac Hale (Emma Smith's father's) affidavit, 1834.




107 posted on 12/05/2010 4:53:40 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie
Question #10: 
Why do Mormons emphasize part of the Word of Wisdom and ignore the part forbidding the eating of meat except in winter, cold or famine?
 
(Doc. & Cov. 89:12,13).


 
 
THE
DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
SECTION 89
 
Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Kirtland, Ohio, February 27, 1833. HC 1: 327–329. As a consequence of the early brethren using tobacco in their meetings, the Prophet was led to ponder upon the matter; consequently he inquired of the Lord concerning it. This revelation, known as the Word of Wisdom, was the result. The first three verses were originally written as an inspired introduction and description by the Prophet.
 
1–9, Use of wine, strong drinks, tobacco, and hot drinks proscribed; 10–17, Herbs, fruits, flesh, and grain are ordained for the use of man and of animals; 18–21, Obedience to gospel law, including the Word of Wisdom, brings temporal and spiritual blessings.
 
  1 A aWord OF Wisdom, for the benefit of the council of high priests, assembled in Kirtland, and the church, and also the saints in Zion—
  2 To be sent greeting; not by commandment or constraint, but by revelation and the aword of wisdom, showing forth the order and bwill of God in the temporal salvation of all saints in the last days—
  3 Given for a principle with apromise, adapted to the capacity of the bweak and the weakest of all csaints, who are or can be called saints.
  4 Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of aevils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of bconspiring men in the last days, I have cwarned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of wisdom by revelation—
  5 That inasmuch as any man adrinketh bwine or strong drink among you, behold it is not good, neither meet in the sight of your Father, only in assembling yourselves together to offer up your sacraments before him.
  6 And, behold, this should be wine, yea, apure wine of the grape of the vine, of your own make.
  7 And, again, astrong drinks are not for the belly, but for the washing of your bodies.
  8 And again, tobacco is not for the abody, neither for the belly, and is not good for man, but is an herb for bruises and all sick cattle, to be used with judgment and skill.
  9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.
  10 And again, verily I say unto you, all wholesome aherbs God hath ordained for the constitution, nature, and use of man—
  11 Every herb in the season thereof, and every fruit in the season thereof; all these to be used with aprudence and bthanksgiving.
  12 Yea, aflesh also of bbeasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used csparingly;
  13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be aused, only in times of winter, or of cold, or bfamine.
  14 All agrain is ordained for the use of man and of beasts, to be the staff of life, not only for man but for the beasts of the field, and the fowls of heaven, and all wild animals that run or creep on the earth;
  15 And athese hath God made for the use of man only in times of famine and excess of hunger.
  16 All grain is good for the afood of man; as also the bfruit of the vine; that which yieldeth fruit, whether in the ground or above the ground—
  17 Nevertheless, wheat for man, and corn for the ox, and oats for the horse, and rye for the fowls and for swine, and for all beasts of the field, and barley for all useful animals, and for mild drinks, as also other grain.
  18 And all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, ashall receive bhealth in their navel and marrow to their bones;
  19 And shall afind bwisdom and great ctreasures of dknowledge, even hidden treasures;
  20 And shall arun and not be bweary, and shall walk and not faint.
  21 And I, the Lord, give unto them a promise, that the adestroying angel shall bpass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them. Amen.


108 posted on 12/05/2010 4:57:27 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie
D&C 89:19
And shall find wisdom and great treasures of knowledge, even hidden treasures;


You can take the boy out of the country...

109 posted on 12/05/2010 4:58:43 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie
 
 MORMON
Chapter 6

The Nephites gather to the land of Cumorah for the final battles—Mormon hides the sacred records in the hill Cumorah—The Lamanites are victorious, and the Nephite nation is destroyed—Hundreds of thousands are slain with the sword. About A.D. 385.

1 And now I finish my record concerning the destruction of my people, the Nephites. And it came to pass that we did march forth before the Lamanites.

2 And I, Mormon, wrote an epistle unto the king of the Lamanites, and desired of him that he would grant unto us that we might gather together our people unto the land of Cumorah, by a hill which was called Cumorah, and there we could give them battle.

3 And it came to pass that the king of the Lamanites did grant unto me the thing which I desired. 

4 And it came to pass that we did march forth to the land of Cumorah, and we did pitch our tents around about the hill Cumorah; and it was in a land of many waters, rivers, and fountains; and here we had hope to gain advantage over the Lamanites.

5 And *when three hundred and eighty and four years had passed away, we had gathered in all the remainder of our people unto the land of Cumorah.

6 And it came to pass that when we had gathered in all our people in one to the land of Cumorah, behold I, Mormon, began to be old; and knowing it to be the last struggle of my people, and having been commanded of the Lord that I should not suffer the records which had been handed down by our fathers, which were sacred, to fall into the hands of the Lamanites, (for the Lamanites would destroy them) therefore I made this record out of the plates of Nephi, and hid up in the hill Cumorah all the records which had been entrusted to me by the hand of the Lord, save it were these few plates which I gave unto my son Moroni.

7 And it came to pass that my people, with their wives and their children, did now behold the armies of the Lamanites marching towards them; and with that awful fear of death which fills the breasts of all the wicked, did they await to receive them.

8 And it came to pass that they came to battle against us, and every soul was filled with terror because of the greatness of their numbers.

9 And it came to pass that they did fall upon my people with the sword, and with the bow, and with the arrow, and with the ax, and with all manner of weapons of war.

10 And it came to pass that my men were hewn down, yea, even my ten thousand who were with me, and I fell wounded in the midst; and they passed by me that they did not put an end to my life.

11And when they had gone through and hewn down all my people save it were twenty and four of us, (among whom was my son Moroni) and we having survived the dead of our people, did behold on the morrow, when the Lamanites had returned unto their camps, from the top of the hill Cumorah, the ten thousand of my people who were hewn down, being led in the front by me.

12 And we also beheld the ten thousand of my people who were led by my son Moroni.

13 And behold, the ten thousand of Gidgiddonah had fallen, and he also in the midst.

14 And Lamah had fallen with his ten thousand; and Gilgal had fallen with his ten thousand; and Limhah had fallen with his ten thousand; and Jeneum had fallen with his ten thousand; and Cumenihah, and Moronihah, and Antionum, and Shiblom, and Shem, and Josh, had fallen with their ten thousand each.

15 And it came to pass that there were ten more who did fall by the sword, with their ten thousand each; yea, even all my people, save it were those twenty and four who were with me, and also a few who had escaped into the south countries, and a few who had deserted over unto the Lamanites, had fallen; and their flesh, and bones, and blood lay upon the face of the earth, being left by the hands of those who slew them to molder upon the land, and to crumble and to return to their mother earth.

16 And my soul was rent with anguish, because of the slain of my people, and I cried:

17 O ye fair ones, how could ye have departed from the ways of the Lord! O ye fair ones, how could ye have rejected that Jesus, who stood with open arms to receive you!

18 Behold, if ye had not done this, ye would not have fallen. But behold, ye are fallen, and I mourn your loss.

19 O ye fair sons and daughters, ye fathers and mothers, ye husbands and wives, ye fair ones, how is it that ye could have fallen!

20 But behold, ye are gone, and my sorrows cannot bring your return.

21 And the day soon cometh that your mortal must put on immortality, and these bodies which are now moldering in corruption must soon become incorruptible bodies; and then ye must stand before the judgment-seat of Christ, to be judged according to your works; and if it so be that ye are righteous, then are ye blessed with your fathers who have gone before you.

22 O that ye had repented before this great destruction had come upon you. But behold, ye are gone, and the Father, yea, the Eternal Father of heaven, knoweth your state; and he doeth with you according to his justice and mercy.


 
 
Mormon 8:2
And now it came to pass that after the great and tremendous battle at Cumorah, behold, the Nephites who had escaped into the country southward were hunted by the Lamanites, until they were all destroyed.

110 posted on 12/05/2010 5:33:26 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie

Your arguments are at odds with each other. First you say that the book of mormon isn’t what it claims to be because you can’t find any artifacts or archeological sites to back it up. Then you say that there is no evidence that god is, so you just have to believe and that’s ok. So which is it?

Either god reveals truth to his children or he doesn’t. It wouldn’t have occurred to me that he depended on archeologists to really drive his point home.


111 posted on 12/05/2010 5:44:14 AM PST by nando9
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To: Elsie
JS did NOT sit at a table, flipping the golden plates over, writing down the Reformed Egyptian® into 1611 English as he went; but stuffed his face into a HAT, and dictated words to one of his his stenographers, who wrote the words down.

Couldn't say it better than that!

112 posted on 12/05/2010 5:44:58 AM PST by Utah Binger (Southern Utah, where the world comes to see America)
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To: MHGinTN
Wow, I was so upset at reading your post that I mistakenly used a contraction when I should have written a possessive pronoun. I’m still shock at the disconnect

Dreadful. *snicker*

113 posted on 12/05/2010 6:35:06 AM PST by houeto ("You know, I actually believe my own bullsh_t," --- BHO)
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To: Utah Binger

And?

Which is more impressive, do you think? Dictating a 500+ page book, or translating it while looking at some ancient documents?

By the by, the urim and thummim were part of old testament rituals — more hocus pocus?


114 posted on 12/05/2010 9:51:24 AM PST by nando9
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To: nando9; Elsie
Reformed Egyptian® into 1611 English?

That is the question. Please pay attention and do your critical thinking before posting.

115 posted on 12/05/2010 11:11:00 AM PST by Utah Binger (Southern Utah, where the world comes to see America)
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To: nando9
First you say that the book of mormon isn’t what it claims to be because you can’t find any artifacts or archeological sites to back it up.

I'm sorry I was misunderstood.

I meant that IF it were what it claimed to be; then there SHOULD be artifacts in abundance - with all other things being equal.

Why isn't there?

WHY hasn't MORMONism dug up the Hill all over the place?

After all; that is JS' legacy: digging in the dirt looking for treasure.

116 posted on 12/05/2010 11:37:06 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Utah Binger
15 And it came to pass that there were ten more who did fall by the sword, with their ten thousand each; yea, even all my people, save it were those twenty and four who were with me, and also a few who had escaped into the south countries, and a few who had deserted over unto the Lamanites, had fallen; and their flesh, and bones, and blood lay upon the face of the earth, being left by the hands of those who slew them to molder upon the land, and to crumble and to return to their mother earth.


Houston: We have a problem.

117 posted on 12/05/2010 11:38:57 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going.)
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To: Elsie

YaBut whutchoo don’t know is at them there glaciers un floods and stuff come ther un washed all them bones un stuff away. I thunk long an hard.

Yer jist tryin to cause us’ns problums you dirty anti. Un quit callin me a retread BooB...er NooB.


118 posted on 12/05/2010 11:56:06 AM PST by Utah Binger (Southern Utah, where the world comes to see America)
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To: Elsie

Yes, ok.

But my question still stands — why does it matter? If the god of the universe tells someone by the spirit of truth what is true, why would that person care if modern archeologists found artifacts?

And if it does matter somehow, I’m fairly certain they just uncovered a new viking site in the middle of Old Town Stockholm. Last week. So the argument that something isn’t found today is hardly conclusive as to somethings possible existence.


119 posted on 12/05/2010 3:29:28 PM PST by nando9
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To: Utah Binger

I actually have no idea what you just said.

But if I assume that you are agreeing with the uber-bolded text above, I’m guessing you are excited about the idea that the said bones should have turned up somewhere by now.

To each his own, I suppose. How do you like the ark of the covenant?


120 posted on 12/05/2010 3:29:36 PM PST by nando9
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