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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
Are the glorified saints in heaven dead?

Yes

Is asking the saints in heaven to pray for us the same thing as conjuring spirits?

Yes

In Revelation 5:8, the saints in heaven offer our prayers to God.

No, they don't:

Rev 5:8
And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four [and] twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.
Doesn't say that they are our prayers (that is--live saints). They could be. But not necessarily. And it also does not say that it is the saints doing this, but the elders and beasts mentioned.

Also notice that the "prayers of the saints" are going to the Lamb--not Mary. And nowhere in that account does it say that Mary passed these along. This passage does not support prayers to Mary.

223 posted on 01/18/2012 8:25:11 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ShadowAce

Maybe we should take our disagreement “to the church,” as Jesus recommended.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a9p6.htm

I find Church teaching to be beautiful, like a fine diamond.


227 posted on 01/18/2012 8:49:55 AM PST by St_Thomas_Aquinas
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To: ShadowAce

“To conjure means “to summon( a devil or a spirit) by magical or supernatural power.” (The American Heritage College dictionary). Surely you do not confuse a prayer to Mary or a saint with anything like that?


257 posted on 01/18/2012 10:30:11 AM PST by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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