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To: CynicalBear

I saw that coming, and wondered why the author included it, because it’s hotly contriverted between Catholics and Protestants, and not central to his argument

The problem is that the passage says, “born from above,” in the Greek. “From above” is idiomatically used occasionally to mean, “once more,” sort of like the way we will use “over.” Nicodemus plainly takes this as the meaning of Jesus (3:4), but Jesus immediately corrects him. The problem with King James and subsequent English translations is that the translation, “born again” captures only Nicodemus’ false understanding, and none of the literal meaning.


7 posted on 04/16/2012 5:29:55 AM PDT by dangus
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To: dangus

Huh... the second part didn’t print...

Anyway...

Born again, means “born once over.” Something “done over” is done the right way. You don’t call a “do over” on a perfect play. What makes it perfect? Jesus explains, that it means being born of water and spirit. The water is a reference to baptism. What the author of this post stated is that there is no need for a “born again EXPERIENCE;” There is no need to do things the wrong way first. A child born of Christian parents who instruct him well and blessedly in the faith has no need to go screw up his life utterly, and then only as an adult be born of water and spirit. I don’t mean he doesn’t mean to be born “once over,” simply that the baptism and upbringing he receives suffices, so long as he relies upon God his entire life.

When the disciples baptized entire households, there is no mention of children being excluded. Nor is mention made of any children of followers of Christ being baptized once they reached adult age. To the contrary, the bible explicitly states that entire households (which would include extended families, servants, and the servants’ families) were baptized at once.


17 posted on 04/16/2012 5:47:38 AM PDT by dangus
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