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To: roamer_1

My mistake, it’s Romans 14. But, yes, let’s look at the chapter:

1 Accept the one whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. 2 One person’s faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. 3 The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. 4 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.
5 One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. 7 For none of us lives for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone. 8 If we live, we live for the Lord; and if we die, we die for the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. 9 For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

10 You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat them with contempt? For we will all stand before God’s judgment seat. 11 It is written:

“‘As surely as I live,’ says the Lord,
‘every knee will bow before me;
every tongue will acknowledge God.’”

12 So then, each of us will give an account of ourselves to God.

13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister. 14 I am convinced, being fully persuaded in the Lord Jesus, that nothing is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for that person it is unclean. 15 If your brother or sister is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy someone for whom Christ died. 16 Therefore do not let what you know is good be spoken of as evil. 17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, 18 because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and receives human approval.

19 Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. 20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. 21 It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother or sister to fall.

22 So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves. 23 But whoever has doubts is condemned if they eat, because their eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.

Sorry, Roamer, I do not see this ONLY referring to fasting, but in ALL things we should act by faith. Man was not made for the sabbath, but the sabbath for the man, our Lord said. We all NEED a day of rest, I agree, but we do not live under the Jewish law, but under grace. That “set-aside/apart” day (which the word “holy” means) is between us and God and no one else has the right to judge another on that.


17 posted on 04/25/2012 8:45:33 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: boatbums
Boatbums, Sorry this reply is so long in coming, I don't come around as often as I used to, and it got lost in my pinglist....

Sorry, Roamer, I do not see this ONLY referring to fasting, but in ALL things we should act by faith. Man was not made for the sabbath, but the sabbath for the man, our Lord said. We all NEED a day of rest, I agree, but we do not live under the Jewish law, but under grace. That “set-aside/apart” day (which the word “holy” means) is between us and God and no one else has the right to judge another on that.

What you have said here is seen through a greek/roman paradigm... Remember that these folks are Torah observant Hebrews. In order for me to accept your conclusion, then I can only conclude that Yeshua as a Rabbi and prophet, and his followers after him, 'have taken away from the Torah' - which marks them as false.

Yeshua did not change the law. He cannot. Neither is the law fulfilled in it's entirety (nor will it ever be as portions are eternal). And The Master did not say the law can be changed at all, but rather, upheld in it's entirety:

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

(e-Sword:KJV)

The KEY to understanding the above passage is to understand why the scribes and Pharisees are unrighteous. This is a very long study, but well worth it, as you will find that invariably, Yeshua criticized the leaders in His day for adding to and taking from the Torah - in Every_Single_Case. Not once will you find Yeshua taking exception with the Torah - Only with the commandments of men. In any case, the above passage clearly states, from the Master's own mouth, that we are to DO and TEACH the Torah, which should be enough to change your mind.

I will agree with you that we live under grace - but then so has everyone since the fall of Adam. The Law has never been salvific. It teaches how to worship properly, right-living for humans, and defines sin. We are no longer bound by the curses of the law, by way of a Perfect Sacrifice - but the blessings of the law endure. We are now bound to the law in LOVE. If we love Him, we will keep His commandments. Do a word search for 'love commandments' in the NT and understand just what emphasis is put upon the law.

As for the Sabbath, remember the prophecy. Who is it that changes the times and seasons (the Sabbath and Holy Days)? There is only one possibility in all of history, and that entity not only admits that it HAS changed them, but brashly proclaims it's right to do so.

Far be it from you my very dear FRiend, to let !!!TRADITION!!! light your way - Herein lies the best defense for Sola-Scriptura: How can the Word incarnate be different than the Word written down? Does YHWH have two minds, different one from the other?

19 posted on 04/29/2012 12:30:14 PM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)
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