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To: verga
And if you had concrete examples of this you would have cited them.

Ask and you shall receive.

And there are plenty more examples than this.

Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extra_Ecclesiam_nulla_salus

Pope Boniface VIII, Bull Unam sanctam (1302): "We are compelled in virtue of our faith to believe and maintain that there is only one holy Catholic Church, and that one is apostolic. This we firmly believe and profess without qualification. Outside this Church there is no salvation and no remission of sins, the Spouse in the Canticle proclaiming: 'One is my dove, my perfect one. One is she of her mother, the chosen of her that bore her' (Canticle of Canticles 6:8); which represents the one mystical body whose head is Christ, of Christ indeed, as God. And in this, 'one Lord, one faith, one baptism' (Ephesians 4:5). Certainly Noah had one ark at the time of the flood, prefiguring one Church which perfect to one cubit having one ruler and guide, namely Noah, outside of which we read all living things were destroyed… We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff."

Pope Eugene IV, Cantate Domino (1441): "The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the "eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels" (Matthew 25:41), unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church."

Saint Gregory the Great (590-604), Moralia: "Now the holy Church universal proclaims that God cannot be truly worshipped saving within herself, asserting that all they that are without her shall never be saved."

And now since Vatican 2 that has all changed.

254 posted on 06/06/2012 5:04:36 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom; verga
"And now since Vatican 2 that has all changed."

Only to the superficial and simple. The doctrines of the Church have been refined but not changed. Holding to the earlier edicts the Church proclaims that genesis of the salvation is from the Church and through the Church.

A good example for your case is your belief in Sola Scriptura. The Scripture you believe is all that is necessary for your Salvation is from and through the Church.

Peace be with you.

256 posted on 06/06/2012 6:01:49 PM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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To: metmom
Yeah I knew you would start with that one, you just make it to easy.

Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus: There are two ways of translating "Extra." Many people translate it "Without" This would mean that anyone who has never heard of Jesus is going to Hell, or anyone that is not Catholic is going to Hell.

That Translation is incorrect, the correct one is found in the text you quoted "Outside" This refers to those people that have intentionally separated themselves from the Catholic Church, or intentionally refuse admission to her graces.

In other words the willfully ignorant will be seated in the smoking section.

BTW clarification is not "Changing a position".

Nice try though, thanks for playing,now lets see if our sponsors have some lovely parting gifts for you.

294 posted on 06/07/2012 2:23:42 AM PDT by verga (Party like it is 1773)
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