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To: iontheball

How does that explain then, the many Catholics who lead less than exemplary lives?

Do you include Kennedy, Kerry, Pelosi, etc. in that group?

The Holy Spirit is given when one believes, not when they dunked or splahed.


71 posted on 06/30/2012 8:07:10 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slav)
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To: metmom; Cronos
"Do you include Kennedy, Kerry, Pelosi, etc. in that group?"

When anyone rejects from their faith and embraces sin it does not matter what that faith was. To continue to attempt to characterize all Catholics with the example of Kennedy, Kerry and Peolsi is as intellectually dishonest as attempting to characterize all Protestants based upon the actions of Barak Obama, Bill Clinton, Jimmy Carter, Maxine Waters, Pete Stark, Lynn Woolsey, and Jessie Jackson.

Now, as you recently advised Cronos, get over yourself.

76 posted on 06/30/2012 8:32:11 AM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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To: metmom

And then there is the baptist Clinton. However, while we can separate from such and join other particular churches within the body of Christ, the problem with the liberal RCs which are the majority (in contrast with evangelicals), is that they are treated by Rome as members in life and in death, and the more conservative are stuck with them. Thus many conservative Catholics feel compelled to do separate in schism, such as the SSPX and sedevacantists. Whose criticism can be seen as quite warranted. (www.the-pope.com/wvat2tec.html)

RC apologist Robert Sungenis states: Yes, “fundamentalism” [in Bible interpretation] certainly has its problems but they are minor compared to the outright heresies coming from the liberals and modernists in most of Catholic biblical scholarship today. (www.catholicintl.com/index.php/component/content/article/53-scripture/181-is-the-bible-true-or-not)

Some join the Orthodox, and which contend,

In the Roman Catholic Church, Apostolic Succession itself resides in the person of the Pope, who is Christ’s Vicar on earth...

Thus, when Roman Catholic traditionalists separate from Rome over issues of traditional practice, they obviously separate themselves from the very source of Roman Catholic authenticity. One can persuasively argue that since, unlike Orthodox, they do not attribute primacy to Holy Tradition, Roman Catholic traditionalists have no foundation on which to justify their schism from the Mother Church of Rome, especially when such separation is forbidden by the Pope himself, the very criterion of authenticity. From the “Question and Answer” section of Orthodox Tradition, Vol. IX, No. 4, p. 15. Originally titled “Traditionalist Catholics.” www.orthodoxinfo.com/inquirers/rome_orth.aspx)


83 posted on 06/30/2012 11:09:07 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a damned+morally destitute sinner,+trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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