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To: metmom
"The *church* is not an ark. It saves no one. There is no other name under heaven by which we must be saved except that of Jesus Christ. The only safe place is Christ. HE is our refuge, not some organization."

"We believe the Church as the mother of our new birth, and not in the Church as if she were the author of our salvation." — Bishop Faustus of Riez

Christ established His Church as the means by which people may come to Him. Hence, to willfully place onesself outside the Church founded by Christ is to willfully place onesself in opposition to Christ. Obedience to the Church of Christ is the way in which we comply ourselves with His will and are made, by Him alone, receptive to grace -- the same as with works.

"And once we are born again, we are transferred into the kingdom of the Son God loves and are seated with Him in the heavenly places. Our salvation is complete in the spiritual realm. For that reason, there is therefore no more condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus."

Matthew 24:13, Matthew 10:22, Luke 21:19, 1 Corinthians 9:27.

292 posted on 04/29/2014 5:34:36 AM PDT by Wyrd bið ful aræd (Pope Calvin the 1st, defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades)
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd
"We believe the Church as the mother of our new birth, and not in the Church as if she were the author of our salvation." — Bishop Faustus of Riez

What nonsense. The church doesn't give us new life. The Holy Spirit does. Jesus said so here....

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

Christ established His Church as the means by which people may come to Him. Hence, to willfully place onesself outside the Church founded by Christ is to willfully place oneself in opposition to Christ. Obedience to the Church of Christ is the way in which we comply ourselves with His will and are made, by Him alone, receptive to grace -- the same as with works.

It's the Holy Spirit that enlightens one spiritually and draws men to God.

The Catholic church has some chutzpah to keep taking credit for the work of God the Holy Spirit.

Philippians 2:13 ....for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.

295 posted on 04/29/2014 7:58:16 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith....)
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd

We can’t divide God’s Word against itself. It’s not a matter of choosing passages that seem to say one thing while ignoring passages that seem to say the opposite. God wills us to consider them all and how they are to be understood together. The same Paul who talked about not wanting to be disqualified himself after preaching to others also wrote that we are saved by grace through faith, which is not from ourselves but a gift from God, as well as many other passages along the same lines. But he also wrote about the need for holiness and for the church not to live according to the flesh, but to walk according to the Spirit. The other New Testament writers talked about things in the same way, and they all did because that’s what Jesus Himself taught, as is shown in the Gospels. Jesus emphasized faith and works in different ways, making it clear that faith would produce fruit, and works alone didn’t please God.


301 posted on 04/29/2014 8:33:21 AM PDT by Faith Presses On
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