Posted on 06/15/2014 12:52:19 PM PDT by Laissez-faire capitalist
1.) An infant is baptized, is raised by believing parents and later when older turns from the faith.
2.) An infant is baptized, has no believing parents to be raised by, and when older doesn't turn from the faith.
Given that the antithesis exists for 1 & 2, wouldn't it be prudent for the priest to baptize the fortunate infant as well as the unfortunate, as either could remain faithful when older, show perseverance against high odds, and no priest knows the future - only God Almighty?
Given that only God knows the future, perhaps withholding baptism isn't an option at all for the priest. If the priest is unsure about 1, 2 or the antithesis for both, should they let God do their baptizing for them if they lack faith?
was just reading this one myself.
this is the same RCC that teaches indulgences, the assumption of mary, the immaculate conception, Jesus had no brothers or sisters and that Mary was a perpetual virgin, that only the pope can tell you what a verse means, that mary is intervening for you, that she is the queen of heaven, that her power is almost unlimited, that peter was the first pope, that he was the primary apostle, that paul acknowledged peter as first amongst the apostle, etc, etc, etc.
if the RCC teaches these non-biblical things why should anyone take their interpretation of anything to be valid?
guess the thief on the cross got a raw deal then...what with not be able to be baptized and all.
I've not known of a SBC church that doesn't baptize.
Outside of the catholic church in Christianity this would nullify everything Paul, and others in the New Testament, wrote about confessing the Lord Jesus Christ....haven't seen too many babies that can confess much....other than just cry.
just because mom and dad say a prayer for you doesn't make you saved. You personally have to do this for yourself.
and why would they be in need of baptism
because they had placed their trust in Christ...hence the need for baptism.
Jesus: I am the way, the truth and the life...no one comes to the Father but through Me.
all due respect to other "religions" but if they have not placed their faith and trust in Christ, they do not go to Heaven.
He did however get baptized.
In the Religion forum, on a thread titled Can an infant be baptized, be raised by believing parents & later turn from the faith?, Laissez-faire capitalist wrote:
“Problem is, no proof that all of them were baptized.”
In fact, no proof ANY of them were from the Catholic foundling home. No proof. None. No count of how many skeletons, no proof they where born alive or stillborn, no evidence of the era of death. Nothing but a sensational headline that you seem fascinated with.
Why is that?
Problem being that the Bible wasn’t written in English, and sometimes Greek can be a little fuzzy.
This is the best ten minutes you’ll ever hear on this verse.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjcrsZFVyKw
When logic and thought fails, post a cartoon picture...
I can't say that you use a perverted scripture out of deceit or are just ignorantly following what your handlers tell you...
Here's the real verse...
1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
This is pretty much the same verse that your religion used for over a thousand years in the Douay-Rheims bible, authored by the very Catholic Jerome...
You might want to ask them why they perverted the scriptures...Apparently to teach false doctrine...
Paul in Ephesians 3: 4-5 "In reading this, then, you will be able to understand my insight into the mystery of Christ, 5which was not made known to people in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets."
Sure sounds like Paul is saying we can read and understand the mystery of Christ to me.
Acts 2:38-39
Peter (said) to them, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the holy Spirit. For the promise is made to you and to your children and to all those far off, whomever the Lord our God will call.”
The New Testament speaks of the baptism of “whole households” which in the normal Greek usage of the time included children.
1 Cor 1:16
I (Paul) baptized the household of Stephanas also ...
Acts 11:13-14
He related to us how he had seen (the) angel standing in his house, saying, ‘Send someone to Joppa and summon Simon, who is called Peter, who will speak words to you by which you and all your household will be saved.’
Acts 16:15
After she (Lydia of Thyatira) and her household had been baptized, she offered us an invitation...
Acts 16:30-32
Then he (the jailer) brought them (Paul and Silas) out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you and your household will be saved.” So they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to everyone in his house.
Acts 18:8
Crispus, the synagogue official, came to believe in the Lord along with his entire household.
To the Colossians, Paul paralleled baptism and circumcision. Circumcision was normally administered to children eight days after birth.
Col 2:11-12
In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not administered by hand, by stripping off the carnal body, with the circumcision of Christ. You were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.
To the Corinthians, Paul recalled that just as all the Jews of the Exodus (including children) were baptized into Moses by passing through the Red Sea, they were actually being blessed by Christ.
1 Cor 10:1-4
I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea, and all of them were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. All ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they drank from a spiritual rock that followed them, and the rock was the Christ.
In Mark’s Gospel, we have Jesus’ own teaching on children.
Mk 10:13-16
And people were bringing children to him that he might touch them, but the disciples rebuked them. When Jesus saw this he became indignant and said to them, “Let the children come to me; do not prevent them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these.” ... Then he embraced them and blessed them, placing his hands on them.
The Roman Catholic Church teaches that baptism is necessary for salvation after the promulgation of the Gospel for everyone, both children and adults.
Jn 3:5
Jesus answered (Nicodemus), “Amen, amen, I say to you, no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and Spirit.”
It is frequently asked by non-believers how an infant is capable of making an act of faith in order to receive baptism. The response of the Catholic Church is to follow the Biblical example of Christ. Jesus accepted the faith of others as an occasion of salvation, forgiveness and healing of another. The Church has always done likewise. In infant baptism, the faith of parents and sponsors is required.
Mk 2:1-5
When Jesus returned to Capernaum ... They came bringing to him a paralytic carried by four men. Unable to get near Jesus because of the crowd, they opened up the roof above him. After they had broken through, they let down the mat on which the paralytic was lying. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Child, your sins are forgiven.”
Mt 8:5-13
When he entered Capernaum, a centurion approached him and appealed to him, saying, “Lord, my servant is lying at home paralyzed, suffering dreadfully.” He said to him, “I will come and cure him.” The centurion said in reply, “Lord, I am not worthy to have you enter under my roof; only say the word and my servant will be healed.” ... When Jesus heard this, he was amazed and said to those following him, “Amen, I say to you, in no one in Israel have I found such faith.” ... And Jesus said to the centurion, “You may go; as you have believed, let it be done for you.” And at that very hour (his) servant was healed.
“In infant baptism, the faith of parents and sponsors is required.”
Sounds like Mormonism. I didn’t realize Catholics believed in proxy salvation...
Still relying on cartoons to save you?
The baby is baptized. Who would be the proxy?
The parents? I don’t think so.
The godparents? I don’t think so.
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