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To: SpirituTuo
By inviting non-Catholics to Rome, I think Pope Francis is following the spirit of Pius XI, and going one step further, inviting them.

But "the one step further" is the rub! This is not what Pius XI is suggesting at all. Pius XI just wrote a whole encyclical explaining what does not equate to religious unity. It spends the whole time explaining that it is only found in the Catholic Church. Nowhere does he suggest that Catholics should pray with non-Catholics in order to help this recognition along. That's because that would have gone against Catholic teaching. He knew that.

Francis has gone one step further: he promotes prayer with non-Catholics which goes against Traditional Church teaching. In doing so, he encourages a false unity which also goes against Traditional Church teaching.

With all the bad popes in pre-VII history of the Catholic Church, you never saw anything like this. And there was good reason for that: it wasn't the teaching of the Catholic Church.

The reason why you and others think this is just fine and dandy is because this has become the norm in the Church these days.

154 posted on 06/29/2014 5:51:21 AM PDT by piusv
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To: piusv

piusv:

Your not 100% accurate. At the Council of Basel-Florence [1431-1445], which all the Orthodox were present for most of it, the opening address states the entire “Universal Church is gathered” so while the Orthodox were in schism from Rome, the term heretic was not applied. Clearly the Catholics and Orthodox gathered together and prayed at that Council. This is well before Vatican 2 obviously.

http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Councils/ecum17.htm

In addition to the meetings I noted above, here also recently met with the leader of the Armenian Orthodox Church which is one of those groups that did not accept the Council of Ephesus in 431. If memory serves me correctly, Pope John Paul II found terminology and agreement so that these Churches are no longer Nestorian. The next step would be to get them to find a theological term to solve the Council of Chalcedon, which will probably not be much of problem given the Nestorian issue is resolved.

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/pope-lauds-armenian-church-leaders-commitment-to-unity/

http://www.armenianorthodoxchurch.org/en/archives/7896

So again, this Pope seems to be willing to meet and talk with lots of Christians from non Catholic Traditions. We see 4 in the last month 1)Armenian orthodox Church, 2) Anglican church, 3) American prosperity evangelical/Pentecostals, and 4) Greek Eastern Orthodox Church delegates from the Patriarch of Constantinopile.

Despite all these meetings, the Pope has not rejected the Nicene or Apostles Creed, nor changed 7 sacraments to 6 or added an 8th, he has not rejected the Primacy of the Pope, nor any other Catholic Doctrine. He has just met with people. Are some of those meetings a waste of time. Maybe? For example, I doubt the meeting in the “Vatican Garden” with the Jewish leader and Palestinian-muslim will amount to anything. I also doubt the meeting with the American prosperity evangelical-Pentecostals will amount to anything. I also doubt the meeting the Primate Welby of the Anglican communion will amount to anything approaching full communion, although working together to stop human trafficking and slavery is a good ecumenical project to work together on.

The meeting with the Armenian orthodox Leader, however, I think might lead to a restoration of full-communion with Rome, which would be a good thing. And of course, the Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church needs to keep working for re-union as a fully united Rome and Orthodox would make for a great Christian witness of Christ’s love for the Church and humanity.

That is my take on it, and that is all it is, my take. Nothing more nothing less. You are free to have your take


159 posted on 06/29/2014 7:59:40 AM PDT by CTrent1564
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To: piusv

I understand where you are coming from, and think you make a valid argument. I did poorly word my response, but stand by my statement that inviting non-Catholics is a good thing.

Regarding a joined/unified liturgical event, I think you are right. Pius XI clearly teaches that shouldn’t take place.

Regarding pre-VII, my opinion is that the Church had a much stronger position in the world, both as a moral authority and political power, thus negating the need to have events like the Pentecost meeting.


166 posted on 06/29/2014 9:40:59 AM PDT by SpirituTuo
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