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To: Springfield Reformer; ebb tide; metmom; boatbums; caww; presently no screen name; redleghunter; ...
Neither of those are prayers.

But RCs excel at extrapolating whatever they want from Scripture, seeing and they have a great deal of liberty to do so, and Scripture is rendered a servant to support Rome, and the weight of its substantiation is not the basis for the veracity of RC teachings.

Thus the explicit instructions on who to address in prayer to heaven, and the direct access Christ enabled by His blood, and the immediate access to Christ Himself as the only and wholly sufficient heavenly intercessor btwn God and man, and the Spirit in us calling to God, and the inexplicable absence of even one example out of the close to 200 prayers in Scripture to anyone in Heaven but the Lord (except by pagans) are dismissed as teaching only God is to be addressed in prayer to Heaven.

And PTDS as a common practice is taught as doctrine based upon an imposed correlation btwn earthly organic relations and that of relations btwn created beings from earth and Heaven. And the offering up of prayers as a memorial by created beings.

And humble Mary is made into an almost almighty demigoddess to whom "Jesus owes His Precious Blood" to,

whose [Mary] merits we are saved by,

who "had to suffer, as He did, all the consequences of sin,"

and "was elevated to a certain equality with the Heavenly Father,"

even so that “sometimes salvation is quicker if we remember Mary's name then if we invoked the name of the Lord Jesus,"

for indeed saints have "but one advocate," and that is Mary, who "alone art truly loving and solicitous for our salvation,"

and whose power now "is all but unlimited,"

for indeed she "seems to have the same power as God,"

"surpassing in power all the angels and saints in Heaven,"

so that "the Holy Spirit acts only by the Most Blessed Virgin, his Spouse."

Moreover, "there is no grace which Mary cannot dispose of as her own, which is not given to her for this purpose,"

and who has "authority over the angels and the blessed in heaven,"

including "assigning to saints the thrones made vacant by the apostate angels,"

whom the good angels "unceasingly call out to," greeting her "countless times each day with 'Hail, Mary,' while prostrating themselves before her, begging her as a favour to honour them with one of her requests,"

and who (obviously) cannot "be honored to excess,"

and who is (obviously) the glory of Catholic people, whose "honor and dignity surpass the whole of creation." Sources .

Yet as i have said before, one would have a hard time in Bible times explaining kneeling before a statue and praising the entity it represented in the unseen world, and as having Divine powers and glory, and making offerings and beseeching such for Heavenly help, directly accessed by mental prayer.

Moses, put down those rocks! I was only engaging in hyper dulia, not adoring her. Can't you tell the difference?

More .

Along with this is reliance upon interpretive statements in the gospels which are compelled to support Rome by ignoring how the rest of the NT manifests their meaning.

Thus the Lord's supper is made into being the "source and summit" of the faith,around which sacrament all else revolves, in which "our redemption is accomplished," with souls gaining spiritual and eternal life thereby, even though this "feast of charity" is only manifestly described once, and in which the church is the body of Christ, which proclaims the Lord's death and their union with Him and each other by how they take part in that communal meal. (1Cor. 11:13-34 )

And being spiritually "nourished" is by "the words of faith and of good doctrine," (1Tim. 4:6) the preaching of which is the main function of NT pastors, not dispensing physical food as "priests," which is not ever shown to be the ordained function of NT priests.

And thus Peter is made to be the first of a line of supreme exalted infallible CEOs that all the church looked to, though the NT nowhere states (interpretative of Mt. 16:18) that He is the rock upon which the church is built, and to whom the church looked to as its supreme exalted infallible head, nor that his office possessed perpetual assured (conditional) infallibility.

But what about the "Hail?" It is simply the word χαιρε ("chaire"), which is basically "cheers!," "be of good cheer!" etc

Consistent with the Catholic technique, Jael must be the fertility saint to pray to:

Blessed above women shall Jael the wife of Heber the Kenite be, blessed shall she be above women in the tent. (Judges 5:24)

36 posted on 07/30/2014 6:24:12 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: daniel1212
As I see it the “war” between Catholics and Protestants will never be over.....though it's mostly verbal exchanges with various members. The heavy duty exchanges , and behind the scenes, are not for public consumption.

Trying to argue with an entity that sees itself as a country and with various ruling parties overseeing it, to that of their naive membership who 'believe' they are active members of a religion, is fruitless....or the matters among would have been settled long ago...they aren't. As I see it the Reformation pretty much settled the matter, but you cannot make someone see what they don't, and will not see as truth, when they have opted for something else and 'believe' IN IT.

What one "Believes" they are a part of is very different then simply being a part of.

45 posted on 07/30/2014 11:00:50 AM PDT by caww
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