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To: one Lord one faith one baptism; redleghunter; boatbums; wmfights; metmom; Springfield Reformer; ...
Wrong. Matthew 24 and 25 clearly covers the whole NT period, culminating in the END OF THE WORLD. you can’t have a 1k year reign if the sun is done and the world has been burned up.

Nowhere does Mt. 24 is state that the sun is done and the world has been burned up to exist no more, but you are reading 2Pt. 3 into this, leaving a great wealth of texts, most of at least 30 chapters. and to allegorize away, so why not the meteorological judgments?

The day of the Lord will see the sun darkened, and the moon not give her light, and other meteorological judgments upon the earth at the end of the tribulation, which Rv. can be seen to detail, signaling the battle of Armageddon.

And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; (Revelation 19:17)

Which also reveals the Lord reigning after in a purified earth for 1k years, before the final judgment of fire coming down from God out of heaven, and devouring them,

where is the “holy place” today? THE CHURCH.

Indeed, but again you seem to have an inability to see anything in parallel, so that Israel can both be Jews as a distinct people, beloved of God, which your own CCC states are the "priestly people of God," and yet be the "Israel of God," the church.

Similarly, here the Lord refers to the place His disciples knew as the holy place, and which existed as that in 70 AD long after the church began, and thus by your logic if it cannot be allowed to refer to future the temple since the church become the temple than it cannot be allowed to be referred to in MT. 24.

the devil was bound at the cross. Jesus said you can’t plunder a man’s house unless you bind the strong man. The Church has been plundering Satan’s kingdom for 2,000 years

Please! This is bordering on the absurd. The Lord was referring to casting out devils in the light of the devil obviously not being bound, and which exorcism some Jews did so as well, (Mt. 12:25-27) and which the Lord prophesied His disciples would after the cross. Thus by your logic the devil was either bound before the cross, or not afterwards.

it is obvious Satan has been loosed for a bit here So now part of Revelation 20 is obviously literal in the light of current events, yet killing and atrocities were just as brutal and iniquity just as prevalent in certain times past, but lacked the modern technology and population density and news reporting of the 20th c. The devil comes to steal, kill and destroy, which has been abundant in every century for over 2,000 years, but just think how many more would have died if they all had modern weapons!

In just Europe i read that over 105,000 people (5.3% death rate) died in just the Wars of the Roses in the 15th century out of a total population of about 2 million, and 190,000 people out of a total population of about 5 million died in just the First English Civil War in the 17th century.

And then you have the the Black Death in the 14th century which claimed an estimated 75 million lives, killed some 75 to 200 million people in Eurasia, in some places 75–80% of the population.

More deaths came by natural disasters, with 830,000 dying in the 1556 Shaanxi earthquake and 900,000–2,000,000 in the 1887 Yellow River (Huang He) flood, and Job 1 attributes a great wind to the devil, showing he could engage in such (by permission).

Meanwhile some studies indicate the world is becoming less violent (Chicago excepted), though i think that is premature.

Thus the idea that the devil has been chained in a bottomless pit is absurd, and is just what he would have you believe. He has always been on a leash, but not bound as in Rv. 20 .

there will be no physical battle of Armageddon. the war is spiritual as shown in Ephesians 6:12.

That requires such a spirtualizing of the description of the details of this Armageddon that you are more like a follower of Mary Baker Eddy.

the Scriptures are quite clear, Jesus is reigning NOW from Jerusalem

Oh come on, enough of this bombast. The Scriptures are anything but quite clear that Jesus is reigning NOW from the new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven. Instead it speaks of a future one. (Rv. 3:12)

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. (Revelation 21:2)

And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, (Revelation 21:10)

248 posted on 09/07/2014 3:52:34 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: daniel1212; redleghunter; editor-surveyor; roamer_1; boatbums; wmfights; CynicalBear

1. “nowhere does Mt 24 state the sun is done”

absolutely it does, “the sun will be darkened” means it no longer will give light. we know this because the moon will not give light and the moon depends on the sun to “give light”. further Revelation 21:23 says there is no need for the sun after the world ends. also Mt 24-25 is the same day right up to the final judgement and NO WHERE does it state the sun resumes giving its light. I invite you to show me where if I am missing it.
Revelation 19:17 is prior to the day of the Lord.

2. the temple of God. ever since Jesus dies and the curtain was torn in two (Matthew 27:50-51 ), the Jewish temple no longer had any religious meaning. the temple God is concerned with and where the Holy Spirit resides, is the believer. so any so called 3rd or 4th temple anywhere in the world built by unbelievers can’t be the temple of God.
further you will notice Mt 24:15 is after Jesus describes the falling away, false prophets arising and the gospel of the kingdom being preached to the whole world. this means it can’t be the destruction of the temple in 70ad, but must refer to the destruction ( almost ) of the Church right before the end of the world.

3. “absurd” - insult all you want, the devil was bound at the cross. what a miracle of God as twelve men and their followers went all through the known world and were able to plunder the strong mans house. and for 2,000 years the Church carried on that mission. then about 50 years ago or so, the world seemed to go off the deep end.......I wonder what happened?

4. spiritualizing and Mary Baker Eddy - funny. imagine “spritualizing” the Word of God?
John 4:24 “ God is spirit and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth”
God set up his revealed Word in the OT using types and shadows of physical and literal events to communicate spiritual and eternal truths. the Jews in Jesus time could not understand this and unfortunately the dispensationalist in our day make the same mistake.

5. Jesus reigning from Jerusalem -

Ephesians 2:6 “ and raised us up with him and made us sit with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus “

the believers citizenship is in the new Jerusalem with our King and every time we submit our will to His, He reigns.

to those outside of Christ, this is foolishness I know.


260 posted on 09/08/2014 6:20:51 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
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