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To: Jan_Sobieski

I think its important to clarify a few things that need to be clarified.

>>>She is not the mother of God the Father. Saying so is to put her before the foundation of the world.<<<

Mary is the mother of the Second person of the Trinity.

We believe that in the Trinity, when one is speaking about a person in the trinity, one is also speaking about God. Such that Jesus is God, He is the Second person of the Trinity, He is God from God, only begotten of the Father.

Motherhood does not imply the source or origin in begetting something. It therefore does not imply that Mary (who is the Mother of God) is the pre-existent origin of the second person.

>>>Mary is eternal, but as a human she had a start, bound by time, space, and humanity. <<<

Mary is the Mother of Jesus foreordained in the eternal plan of salvation by God to be the suitable Mother of God. In as much as she has a relationship with God she is the greatest of God’s creatures. She does not preexist with God before the foundation of the world.

But in the very act of creation, God intended to be born into this world through Mary, because he intended to save mankind by assuming all humanity.

>>>God the father, Son, and Holy Spirit are eternal. She was the vessel that God the father used to bring forth his Son into the world.<<<<

This statement is correct. Like every temple she is Holy, and set apart by God to share humanity with Christ through her cooperation with God’s plan.


144 posted on 09/13/2014 9:19:41 AM PDT by Bayard
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To: Bayard; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; CynicalBear; daniel1212; Gamecock; ...
Mary is the mother of the Second person of the Trinity.

That's got to be some kind of heresy that Catholics have a label for.

That then, makes the second person of the Trinity a created being. That says that the second person of the Trinity is not eternal and that Mary gave him is divine nature.

It makes him not God, because GOD has no mother.

The Incarnation of the second person of the Trinity did.

In as much as she has a relationship with God she is the greatest of God’s creatures.

No, she's not. Jesus said that there was no one born of women who was greater than John the Baptist. The Catholic church teaching otherwise, that Mary is the greatest, it teaching error as it directly contradicts Scripture, the very words of Jesus that so many Catholics esteem more highly than anything else found in the Bible.

Additionally, anyone who is born again by the Holy Spirit has a relationship with God. It's not just Mary. His grace, the same word as the angel used in his greeting to Mary, is poured out on ALL those who believe, who are born again. She's no more special than any other human being whom God has saved because God is not a respecter of persons.

She does not preexist with God before the foundation of the world.

If she gave birth to God, she does. And saying that she's the mother of God says that.

149 posted on 09/13/2014 9:48:03 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: Bayard
Mary is the mother of the Second person of the Trinity.

The flesh part: yes.

The Spirit part: no.

208 posted on 09/14/2014 5:11:17 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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