Posted on 11/19/2014 2:24:41 PM PST by NYer
Here is what Paul had to say about similar circumstances:
I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought. My brothers, some from Chloe's household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What I mean is this: One of you says, "I follow Paul"; another, "I follow Apollos"; another, "I follow Cephas "; still another, "I follow Christ." Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul? I am thankful that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, so no one can say that you were baptized into my name. (Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I don't remember if I baptized anyone else.) For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel--not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.
The earliest days of the Church saw division. It saw people declaring themselves different than others based on who taught them. Paul understood that this emptied the cross of Christ of its power.
You want to save souls? Preach the gospel. Stop trying to correct the Catholics. Stop it. Preach the gospel. The gospel has the power to save people, your "words of human wisdom" empties the cross of Christ of its power.
Feed his lambs.
That’s true...Jesus told Paul to tell every to quit following Peter...
Act 1:13 And when they were come in, they went up into an upper room, where abode both Peter, and James, and John, and Andrew, Philip, and Thomas, Bartholomew, and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus, and Simon Zelotes, and Judas the brother of James.
Act 1:14 These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren.
There is no mention of 120 being in this room...
Act 1:15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)
It doesn't say that same day, it says 'in those days'...Most likely a different day...
Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.
Here, the context is the 12 Apostles...
Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
This is another different day...And it's the next verse...Still a reference to the 12...
Act 2:6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
Act 2:7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
Act 2:8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
These verses tell us the strange tongues were foreign languages...
You need to lighten up; believe God...
I will not claim that there are really not unknown tongues spoken of in the scriptures but the first verses in Acts do not speak of them...
If you Denomination teaches that you can only encounter Jesus Christ through a man made item I offer you numerous Scripture to save your soul.
1 Corinthians 3:16New International Version (NIV)
16 Don’t you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in your midst?
1 Corinthians 6:19New International Version (NIV)
19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;
2 Corinthians 6:16New International Version (NIV)
16 What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said:
“I will live with them
and walk among them,
and I will be their God,
and they will be my people.”
2 Timothy 1:14New International Version (NIV)
14 Guard the good deposit that was entrusted to you—guard it with the help of the Holy Spirit who lives in us.
Ephesians 5:18New International Version (NIV)
18 Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit,
Romans 8:11New International Version (NIV)
11 And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies because of his Spirit who lives in you.
John 16:13New International Version (NIV)
13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.
Romans 8:9New International Version (NIV)
9 You, however, are not in the realm of the flesh but are in the realm of the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ.
Galatians 4:6New International Version (NIV)
6 Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, “Abba, Father.”
And yes we go to Church to socialize also or as the Bible says to encourage one another in our walk of Faith.
Hebrews 10:25New International Version (NIV)
25 not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.
I am not the one with the problem.
They gathered in the upper room.Acts 1:14... then 120 of them in ACTS 1:15. There are at least ten translations of the Bible on this page, and ALL mention the 120 in the upper room:
http://biblehub.com/acts/1-15.htm
Now let me say this, I don’t care what your Bible says, it has been altered if the 120 isn’t in there. The NIV is translated directly from the originals in Hebrew etc, and it is correct, and the older KJV etc all have it in there and you can see them on same page at the link!
This is not an arguable point!
Vs14...
It was only the 12 who spoke in tongues...
120 on the day of Pentecost
Acts 1:15 KJV
[15] And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)
Acts 2:1-4 KJV
[1] And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. [2] And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. [3] And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. [4] And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Gentile believers
Acts 10:44-47 KJV
[44] While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. [45] And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. [46] For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, [47] Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
John’s “followers” who were witnessed to by Paul in acts 19
Acts 19:1-6 KJV
[1] And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, [2] He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. [3] And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism. [4] Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. [5] When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. [6] And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
And Paul who wrote half of the New Testament...whose conversion was recorded in Acts chapter 9 (and was not part of the 12 apostles on the Day of Pentecost) had this to say
1 Corinthians 14:18 KJV
[18] I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
1 Corinthians 14:39 KJV
[39] Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
At this point, he was talking to the church in Corinth whose believers obviously spoke with tongues according to Paul’s comments
In post 10 you said......
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3228845/posts?page=10#10
“The book of ACTS when 3000 where filled with Holy Spirit, and each spoke in tongues, STILL AVAILABLE TO REAL CHRISTIANS.”
So, no, there are no reading comprehension problems with anyone.
The fact that you later corrected what you said does not mean that anyone who read your original post has reading comprehension issues.
Yes
120 on the day of Pentecost Acts 1:15 KJV
[15] And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)
It doesn't really matter whether there were 12 or 120...
Acts 2:1-4 KJV
[1] And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. [2] And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. [3] And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. [4] And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Different day...
And curiously you left out the scriptures that told you plainly these 'tongues' were known, foreign languages...
Act 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
You notice that??? No one is praying in the spirit...They are spitting out words that God gave them to spit out...
Act 2:6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
Act 2:7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
Act 2:8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
Gentile believers Acts 10:44-47 KJV
[44] While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. [45] And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. [46] For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, [47] Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
Yep...And these tongues were a foreign language as explained in Acts 2...And why did they speak in tongues???
1Co_14:22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.
1Co_1:22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
That's why Paul didn't mess much with tongues...In fact, he discouraged it...Paul was the apostle to the Gentiles who did not require a sign...
John’s “followers” who were witnessed to by Paul in acts 19 Acts 19:1-6 KJV
[1] And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, [2] He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. [3] And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism. [4] Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. [5] When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. [6] And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
Not a thing there about tongues being a spiritual language as posed by you guys...
And Paul who wrote half of the New Testament...whose conversion was recorded in Acts chapter 9 (and was not part of the 12 apostles on the Day of Pentecost) had this to say 1 Corinthians 14:18 KJV
[18] I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: 1 Corinthians 14:39 KJV
[39] Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
At this point, he was talking to the church in Corinth whose believers obviously spoke with tongues according to Paul’s comments
Yes they spoke with tongues but there is no indication the tongues were not foreign languages...The speaking in the church was to be that so everyone could understand for the benefit of the church...
1Co 14:19 Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.
1Co 14:20 Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men.
1Co 14:21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.
And then Paul says if you can't interpret or you don't have an interpreter, keep you mouth shut...How many of your preachers stand there babbling in one of their unknown tongues without an interpreter...
And if the preacher's next words are supposed to be an interpretation, what in the world would be the point of the gibberish talk anyway unless it was a foreign language???
All that is, is a 'Look at Me'...'I'm special...I speak in unknown tongues'...
I was only dealing with your comment...where I thought you were saying only 12 people in the Bible spoke in tongues.
And yes I only gave you some scriptures about people speaking in tongues as they received the Holy Spirit.
I also mentioned a couple of scriptures where Paul had talked about himself speaking in tongues.
It was not my intention to have a debate on speaking in tongues...my intention was only to give you those examples where people spoke in tongues.
With respect to what you had said about Paul in 1 Corinthians 14...yes he was dealing with some issues in the Corinthian church, but HE was not one with a “look at me attitude”. And in verse 39, AFTER he had dealt with those issues, you can see he said “forbid not to speak with tongues”
1 Corinthians 14:39-40 KJV
[39] Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues. [40] Let all things be done decently and in order.
So you are saying you are perfect and we have never read your bumbling errors on Free Republic in one post? Seriously?
There were 3000 added to the church on the day of Pentecost after the 120 in the Upper Room.
Okay so you quoted my comment from the Notre Dame 1967 comment....where 3000 were filled with the Holy Spirit, just as the 120 had in the Upper Room.
Referring to the Book Of Acts is about what happened, and if I missed a comma? noting that it was the same experience in ACTS..my apologies.
SO LET ME BE CLEAR for all my posts:
Book of ACTS:
1. 120 were Baptized in Holy Spirit w/ speaking in tongues in Upper Room.
2. 3000 were added to the Church on Day of Pentecost, but not in the Upper Room.
Notre Dame 1967:
3000 were Baptized in Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues while on Campus of Notre Dame.
Sometimes my mind goes faster than I can type, so I skipped the number 120 and got to the number 3000 added to the church without clear clarification. My apologies
OKAY, THAT CONFUSION OF THE 3000 NUMBER SHOULD BE CLEAR TO ALL NOW....
However, my mistake does not contradict nor negate the fact, that the Holy Spirit and the infilling is a real Christian experience, if desired. And the Pope was wise to acknowledge the Pentecostals. In fact, the Charismatic movement in the Catholic Church is alive and well...Thank God!
**The converts to the “evangelical” communities turn out, in fact, to be much more dynamic in propagating the Christian faith. And there is also a difference in helping the poor. While the Catholics assist them and that’s it, the “evangelicals” are not only more active in works of charity, but also do not miss the opportunity to preach the Christian faith to the poor.**
Catholics are learning from these evangelicals.
“While the Catholics assist them and that’s it, the “evangelicals” are not only more active in works of charity, but also do not miss the opportunity to preach the Christian faith to the poor”. No protestant faith does more to help their fellow human being than the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is found in every country in the world, bringing the Gospel of Jesus Christ to every corner of the world. The Catholic Church continues to grow worldwide, not shrink.
Catholic Charities is the biggest faith charity in the world.
The Knights of Columbus, the strong right-arm of the Church, is the world’s largest Catholic fraternal service organization.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_of_Columbus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Charities_USA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Relief_Services
They were just as much scriptures as any of the rest of the New Testament...And more so actually...They were not just pastoral letters...Those epistles are what Jesus told Paul to pass on to the church...
Either Peter knew that what he wrote was scripture, or, he equated what Paul wrote to the scriptures of the Old Testament...
2Pe_3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
I don't care what the 'scholars' say...I know what the scriptures say...
Many so called 'scholars' tell us that Jesus' flesh turns into bread...And that's more NUTS...
dear kack,
I did NOT allude to, refer, make mention, or infer, what you made believe, in your own erroneous mind.
I did not say that i threw away anything, by stating that i ‘was’ a pentecostal. You did. You threw down the condemnation, not me. YOU took it upon YOURSELF, to become the boisterous, self-avenger, not me. You immediately took the stand, the pitcher’s mound, the wicker basket of stones, and am ready to take aim, at me. I have no need to explain to you, or anybody else, since it is none of your business, junior. It is a matter between me, and Providence, alone.
Now, in the words of the immortal William Shakesspeare,
“Get thee to a nunnery!”
Bible: The Hebrews Ch 6 scripture are what I referred to, as you who claimed I ‘was Pentecostal’; past tense.
If a Pentecostal, and in past tense, it meant you would have thrown away the Baptism of the Holy Spirit; which has consequences in scripture, as follows below:
A Call to Maturity
Hebrew 6:4
“…4For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.…”
end.
I did not condemn anyone, that was with your own mouth when you said ‘WAS’ past tense. One is not a Pentecostal unless they have PENTECOST!
As for assumptions, you made one in calling me ‘junior’ since I am female. So is that “the pot calling the kettle black”?
Salvation is between you and Providence alone, but public statements condemning Pentecostal is not. You may have attended a Pentecostal church, but you were NOT Pentecostal, unless you were filled with the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, period....and if that is past tense, then Hebrews 6:4,5 may apply to you.
If you returned to sin denying Christ and the powers of HS, that’s the blasphemy of the unforgivable sin. You can’t blaspheme what you never had, so those who operated in the nine gifts of the spirit are in a unique place...?? Only you know that answer.
Then it is NOT my condemnation but self condemnation, an answer of what is in God’s word at Hebrews 6:4,5...so take it up with God. I did not write the Bible.
I am sure God will forgive and make it right! I don’t believe you were ever Pentecostal, because I have only met one in my lifetime who threw Pentecost away, and he understood what He had given up eternally.
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