Posted on 01/24/2015 3:23:43 PM PST by NYer
What is a Prot like yourself answering this for?
Let our Catholic FRiends answer it!
Neat trick; with ZERO proof.
It takes FAITH to be saved, and one must FIRST be born!
1 Corinthians 15:14
And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
Second; Christ must be RISEN for us to even HAVE any faith!
The statement “All have sinned” was made in a context where Mary was not the topic. The author had no intention of addressing exceptions. He wasn’t writing ABOUT Mary; he wasn’t writing TO Mary. He was writing to an audience that WAS 100% sinners. And if he was thinking of future generations of Christians at all, he would know that 100% of THEM would be sinners.
Infants and mentally disabled people are incapable of sin. On the basis of a single verse of Scripture, ripped out of context, you take the repulsive, preposterous position that they are sinners.
Do you hold that JESUS is a sinner?
Using a single sentence of ANY document, including Scripture, to “answer” a question or to “prove” a point that the author wasn’t even discussing or even thinking about, is to twist, exploit, and misuse that document.
There’s a long history of that kind of “interpretation” of Scripture. For example:
Several authors of Scripture mention slaves or slavery, without ever discussing its morality. They simply mention it as they would any social reality. In their time, the morality of slavery was not being discussed or debated by anybody. In later centuries, these verses were twisted and exploited as “teaching” that slavery is APPROVED BY GOD.
Before you can know what a verse in Scripture means, you must know what the HUMAN AUTHOR was discussing, and what he was not even thinking about. One must know that before leaping to conclusions about what the Holy Spirit intended to teach by that passage.
It is NEVER a valid use of Scripture to rip a word, phrase, or sentence from its context, as though it was intended to answer questions the author was not even thinking about.
You sure called THIS one right!
WHAT!?!?!?
How about a 4 year old?
Can THEY sin?
How about 8?
10??
15???
WHEN????
22 But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. 23 The city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it,[j] for the glory[k] of God illuminated it. The Lamb is its light. 24 And the nations of those who are saved[l] shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.[m] 25 Its gates shall not be shut at all by day (there shall be no night there).
You vipers!
You may believe whatever you like, but you still choose to ignore the clear words of Jesus. This is just a personal opinion that the Words of Jesus were not meant literally.
Then why did Jesus repeat it and not explain that it was not literal?
Why did Jesus say “Do this in Memory of Me” at the Last Supper as Catholics celebrate the Eucharist at Mass?
Why did Luther believe in the “Real Presence”?
I am sure that Satan would accept this alternate explanation so that one does not receive the gift and grace of Christ’s Body and Blood. Satan certainly does not want us to gain salvation.
By four? Probably.
There are certain KINDS of sin that some people cannot commit. A four-year-old can be mean to another child. I doubt a four-year-old can commit treason.
Don’t you?
Yes, I believe the Words of Jesus.
And they baptize infants for WHAT reason??
Since the New Testament era, the Catholic Church has always understood baptism differently, teaching that it is a sacrament which accomplishes several things, the first of which is the remission of sin, both original sin and actual sin—only original sin in the case of infants and young children, since they are incapable of actual sin; and both original and actual sin in the case of older persons.
Peter explained what happens at baptism when he said, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" (Acts 2:38). But he did not restrict this teaching to adults.
Hey!
That is MormonDude's response sometimes!!
Only it goes...
I don't understand everything about Mormonism; but, but golly, I believe it!
Saint Paul says that Abraham was justified because he believed God. I.e., Abraham had faith, and was saved.
Abraham lived BEFORE JESUS, and Abraham had FAITH, BEFORE JESUS.
So, in your book, Saint Paul was a heretic, and his letters contain heresy.
It is ALWAYS a valid use of Catholic teaching to rip a word, phrase, or sentence from its context, along with any others one needs, to backup a tradition that started way back when. This practice is intended to address things that GOD didn't remember to add to His Holy Word, answering questions that even HE was not even thinking about.
Is treason a SIN?
Took the bait; eh?
Thanks!
I read something about that recently. I think it was in Psalms: 51 but I could be wrong.
Let's consider the words of Jesus:
John 6:27 (NLT) - 27 But don’t be so concerned about perishable things like food. Spend your energy seeking the eternal life that the Son of Man can give you. For God the Father has given me the seal of his approval.”
John 6:29 (NLT) - 29 Jesus told them, “This is the only work God wants from you: Believe in the one he has sent.”
John 6:32-40 (NLT) - 32 Jesus said, “I tell you the truth, Moses didn’t give you bread from heaven. My Father did. And now he offers you the true bread from heaven. 33 The true bread of God is the one who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.” 34 “Sir,” they said, “give us that bread every day.” 35 Jesus replied, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never be hungry again. Whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36 But you haven’t believed in me even though you have seen me. 37 However, those the Father has given me will come to me, and I will never reject them. 38 For I have come down from heaven to do the will of God who sent me, not to do my own will. 39 And this is the will of God, that I should not lose even one of all those he has given me, but that I should raise them up at the last day. 40 For it is my Father’s will that all who see his Son and believe in him should have eternal life. I will raise them up at the last day.”
John 6:43-51 (NLT) - 43 But Jesus replied, “Stop complaining about what I said. 44 For no one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them to me, and at the last day I will raise them up. 45 As it is written in the Scriptures, ‘They will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me. 46 (Not that anyone has ever seen the Father; only I, who was sent from God, have seen him.) 47 “I tell you the truth, anyone who believes has eternal life. 48 Yes, I am the bread of life! 49 Your ancestors ate manna in the wilderness, but they all died. 50 Anyone who eats the bread from heaven, however, will never die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Anyone who eats this bread will live forever; and this bread, which I will offer so the world may live, is my flesh.”
John 6:60-65 (NLT) - 60 Many of his disciples said, “This is very hard to understand. How can anyone accept it?” 61 Jesus was aware that his disciples were complaining, so he said to them, “Does this offend you? 62 Then what will you think if you see the Son of Man ascend to heaven again? 63 The Spirit alone gives eternal life. Human effort accomplishes nothing. And the very words I have spoken to you are spirit and life. 64 But some of you do not believe me.” (For Jesus knew from the beginning which ones didn’t believe, and he knew who would betray him.) 65 Then he said, “That is why I said that people can’t come to me unless the Father gives them to me.”
John 6:66-69 (NLT) - 66 At this point many of his disciples turned away and deserted him. 67 Then Jesus turned to the Twelve and asked, “Are you also going to leave?” 68 Simon Peter replied, “Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words that give eternal life. 69 We believe, and we know you are the Holy One of God.”
Now, what is the real revelation found in John 6, eating food, or believing in the Living Word?
Failure to understand figurative language happens more often than it should.
Matthew 16:6-7 (AMP) - 6 Jesus said to them, Be careful and on your guard against the leaven (ferment) of the Pharisees and Sadducees. 7 And they reasoned among themselves about it, saying, It is because we did not bring any bread.
Matthew 16:11-12 (AMP) - 11 How is it that you fail to understand that I was not talking to you about bread? But beware of the leaven (ferment) of the Pharisees and Sadducees. 12 Then they discerned that He did not tell them to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees.
It wasn't bread but the folly of the religious folks. That warning is still good advice.
John 4:11-13 (AMP) - 11 She said to Him, Sir, You have nothing to draw with [no drawing bucket] and the well is deep; how then can You provide living water? [Where do You get Your living water?] 12 Are You greater than and superior to our ancestor Jacob, who gave us this well and who used to drink from it himself, and his sons and his cattle also? 13 Jesus answered her, All who drink of this water will be thirsty again.
It wasn't literal water that Jesus offers.
John 3:3-4 (KJV) - 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. 4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
John 3:10-12 (KJV) - 10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? 11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness. 12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
Nicodemus was a "master of Israel" and still missed it. Revelation knowledge does not come easy to the spiritually dead, or carnal Christians.
1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV) - 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
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