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To: Petrosius

Sorry to annoy you with the facts but compulsory clerical celibacy was not imposed until much later in Church history.

“It is said on good authority that, in the tenth and eleventh centuries half of the priests, in some countries more than half...lived openly as fathers of families.”

Source: A Complete History of the Catholic Church to Present Day by Rev. John Laux.

Rev. Laux btw was a Catholic priest. Further the issue was still being debated as late as the Council of Trent in the 16th Century:

According to Wikipedia.com:

“The Council of Trent considered the matter at its twenty-fourth session decreed that marriage AFTER (emphasis added) ordination was invalid.” So evidently married priests were permitted if they were married before ordination.

The policy was never fully accepted or enforced in much of Europe. Also in 16th Century England, Cardinal Wolsey, the most powerful man in the country-—after the King-—lived quite openly with his common law wife and two children. Truth be told compulsory clerical celibacy was never forcefully enforced until much later.


131 posted on 03/13/2015 8:52:36 AM PDT by Trapped Behind Enemy Lines
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To: Trapped Behind Enemy Lines
“It is said on good authority that, in the tenth and eleventh centuries half of the priests, in some countries more than half...lived openly as fathers of families.”

Source: A Complete History of the Catholic Church to Present Day by Rev. John Laux.

Rev. Laux btw was a Catholic priest.

Still selectively quoting, I see. Let us take a look at the entire passage:

And now let us glance at the results of this enslavement [of the Church to feudalism]. From the moment the selection of candidates for the highest ecclesiastical offices depended solely on the will of kings, men were appointed bishops and abbots for other reasons besides their priestly virtue or learning. If they could give guarantees to the sovereign of their fidelity to his dynasty and to his politics, that was considered more important than if they could interpret Scripture, preach a sermon, or write a learned treatise. Usually, in order to be successful, the aspirant to office had to be endorse by some powerful courtier. But the courtiers did not give their patronage free of charge; they sold it to the highest bidder. "Most of the bishops, therefore, bought their office, and in their turn sold the dignities of secondary order; and the lower clergy, to reimburse themselves, sold the sacraments and the sacramentals." And thus the pest of simony which had been all but stamped out in the Church, began its ravages anew. The consequences of this traffic in sacred things can be readily imagined. A simonaical clergy is bound to be an ignorant and immoral clergy. It is said on good authority that, in the tenth and eleventh centuries, half of the priests, and in some countries more than half, disregarded the law of celibacy and lived openly as fathers of families. And when the clergy fell from their high level, when many bishops were totally indifferent and paid no attention to their spiritual duties, is there any wonder that demoralization set in rapidly among the people? Qualis rex, talks grex--as the ruler, so the people. (pp. 264 - 265)
I bring particular attention to the words that you conveniently left out from the quotation with your ellipsis: "disregarded the law of celibacy." Fr. Laux was stating that this disregard for clerical celibacy was contrary to the law and a result of the corruption of society because of the fall of the Charlemagne empire.

Since you did quote from Fr. Laux's history I take it that you consider it a reliable source. I would therefore bring to your attention what he wrote earlier in that work:

In the West clerical celibacy was no longer merely a general custom as in the earlier centuries; before the end of the fourth century it had become a rigorous obligation, as we know from the letters of several Popes and from the decrees of Italian, Gallic, African, and Spanish synods. Celibacy was binding on ll bishops, priests and deacons. (p. 161)
History just does not support the claim that clerical celibacy was an invention of the Middle Ages.

“The Council of Trent considered the matter at its twenty-fourth session decreed that marriage AFTER (emphasis added) ordination was invalid.” So evidently married priests were permitted if they were married before ordination.

This is still the case. Married men are allowed to be ordained in the Eastern churches. In the West they can be ordained but must observe marital continence. This has been the constant practice in the West.

144 posted on 03/13/2015 10:55:07 AM PDT by Petrosius
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