Sorry, but Jesus didn’t forgive them, he asked God to sometime in the future. That is not the same.
Why didn’t Jesus say that both of the men that hung on crosses with Him would be in Heaven that very day, if he instantly forgave the second of his unrepentant impertinence?
As I keep saying, the very connotation of forgiveness is that it is a reciprocal action that is proceeded by another action.
What you are in fact saying is that I can accept your apology for being totally wrong on this subject, even though you haven’t offered me any such apology. That is quite different than having the capacity and in fact obligation to accept any forthcoming apology, which is the only biblical guidance I see in scripture.
“Sorry, but Jesus didn’t forgive them, he asked God to sometime in the future. That is not the same.”
So, you contend that Jesus was asking the Father to do something that Jesus Himself refused to do? That would seem to contradict John 5:19: “... the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.”
I submit, on the contrary, the only interpretation that is consistent what we know of Jesus, is to take the fact that He asked the Father to forgive as direct evidence that Jesus had already forgiven them.
“Why didn’t Jesus say that both of the men that hung on crosses with Him would be in Heaven that very day, if he instantly forgave the second of his unrepentant impertinence?”
You’re confusing personal forgiveness with other matters again. If either of the men had personally done some wrong to Jesus, then that would be something Jesus could choose to forgive as a personal matter, but that isn’t the case with either of those men.
“As I keep saying, the very connotation of forgiveness is that it is a reciprocal action that is proceeded by another action.”
But it isn’t. There is no reciprocation required at all. If I forgive a debt that is owed to me, absolutely no action is required of the debtor, and so it is with our spiritual debts as well.
“What you are in fact saying is that I can accept your apology for being totally wrong on this subject, even though you haven’t offered me any such apology.”
No, I am not saying that. I am saying you can forgive someone without them asking for an apology, and that forgiveness is not the same thing as accepting an apology.