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To: ADSUM; metmom
There is a problem, a gap so wide that we can hardly be heard across it. To ME, to say, as Msgr. Pope does (and you, and others do) that the Episkopos and Presbyteroi of the Church are priests in Christ's priesthood ... TO ME that makes perfect sense and is congruent with 1 Cor 12 and elsewhere.

So WE would say, there is ONE Priest, even our Lord IHS XP, and the bishops and priests are priests in Him. It's not a multiplicity any more (or less) than any body is.

But metmom, hearing us says this, says, more or less, "There is ONE priest." And we are left shaking our heads because we thought we just said that!

(In this connection it's fun to do a word study on the phrase "in Christ" and related phrases like "in Him," or "in me" in the gospels and Paul.)

In related news, while the various contending schools of dispensationalists are impressive in their scholarship and their certainty, they strike me (no offense meant to anyone) as tone-deaf to the questions of time and eternity, of a changeless God engaging with temporal creatures.

So they cite a truly impressive array of verses and passages and,as it were, fold their arms and say,"Q.E.D." And yet I am almost completely unmoved and unpersuaded because, as far as I can see, they are imposing "enlightenment" and even materialist and empiricist categories in questions before which materialism and empiricism crumple.

While the REAL, 8-cylinder, turbo-charged, fuel-injected gnostics accuse of of being crudely materialistic, a great many Protestants and other non-Catholics say we are "mystical." But it is philosophy baptized (I mean, philosophy perfected by revelation) that leads me to say that an unnoticed arbutus in an unbaptized land sings a song of praise to the Creator which only those who have been graced with the Spirit will understand (to some small extent) but which all those aware of their longing for something outside the world may, MAY, hear.

To me personally and as a dilettante philosopher, the song of the flower which today is and tomorrow is not is a matter of grave importance when I, creeping on my knees, approach the throne of grace.

To them some of what I just wrote is incomprehensible and the rest perilously mistaken. Conversation will not flow smoothly.

21 posted on 08/01/2015 6:15:33 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Sta, si cum canibus magnis currere non potes, in portico.)
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To: Mad Dawg
1 Timothy 3:1-13 The saying is trustworthy: If anyone aspires to the office of overseer, he desires a noble task. Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. He must manage his own household well, with all dignity keeping his children submissive, for if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church? He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. Moreover, he must be well thought of by outsiders, so that he may not fall into disgrace, into a snare of the devil.

Deacons likewise must be dignified, not double-tongued, not addicted to much wine, not greedy for dishonest gain. They must hold the mystery of the faith with a clear conscience. And let them also be tested first; then let them serve as deacons if they prove themselves blameless. Their wives likewise must be dignified, not slanderers, but sober-minded, faithful in all things. Let deacons each be the husband of one wife, managing their children and their own households well. For those who serve well as deacons gain a good standing for themselves and also great confidence in the faith that is in Christ Jesus.

Elders and deacons. Not priests.

The mediation for salvation is done through Jesus alone. That's why God tore the curtain in the Temple in two.

It's not needed any more because of the FINISHED work of Christ on the cross. Therefore, there is no need for an earthly priesthood.

No priests (whatever denomination) can claim to be doing (present tense) the done/finished (past tense) work of Jesus. Jesus is seated at the right hand of God in heaven. He is not ministering at an altar anywhere. How can they claim to be representing Jesus when they are not doing what He's doing?

25 posted on 08/01/2015 6:59:21 PM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: Mad Dawg

“To them some of what I just wrote is incomprehensible and the rest perilously mistaken. Conversation will not flow smoothly.”

I found it interesting. In a less “artsy” way, Romans 1 backs you up in that the creation speaks proof of the Living God.

I believe John was dealing with “REAL, 8-cylinder, turbo-charged, fuel-injected gnostics” in his first letter, lol. He pulled their engine and shut ‘em down real good, though.


31 posted on 08/01/2015 10:26:32 PM PDT by avenir (I'm pessimistic about man, but I'm optimistic about GOD!)
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