[MHGinTN]

You offered, "We don’t simply recognize Christ as Savior and expect the miracle of Grace to have effect in our lives." AND I WOULD ASK YOU WHY NOT? It is by Grace you are saved, not of works lest any-man boast. It is God Who comes into you at new birth, in the Person of The Holy Spirit, The Restrainer, and He raises you up int he way that you should go. Would you presume to take that job and not allow God to do in you for His good pleasure and plan? I can testify at 70 that it is ONLY God Who can effect my life with His Grace. That's what He is doing in the Church AGE! You also offered, "Christ was and is perfect. He did not deserve either death or banishment but He suffered both so that when we stand before the judgment seat of God and the books are opened and we are found to be sinners Christ can say, “yes, he is a sinner and I have already received his punishment, he/she stays with Me." You stated it, do you actually comprehend what that means in your transformation with God in you in this life?

It would help you if you would study and discover whether those born from above will be standing at the Judgment you have cited. You can choose to stand there ... or you can choose to believe Jesus has already endured the judgment for you, as in faithing in Him for deliverance. Faith is an action word. You faithe in Christ to direct you each and every day, so that your sin nature loses power over you.

It is soterology, the deliverance ONLY Jesus has accomplished and offers to you and to me by His Grace for believing in Him as our Lord and Savior. When you do that in this life, you will not be standing for judgment later. You will stand before the Bema Seat of Christ IN HEAVEN, but you will not stand before the Judgment here on Earth in the future.

[JAKraig]

I personally do not believe in the concept of once saved always saved, I believe that when God put Adam and Eve into the garden of Eden and told them not to partake of the tree with the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil that while he gave them the command he also gave them the opportunity to choose.

God sacrificed his son and gives us the opportunity to take advantage of the gift that He has offered us, Grace. No one is forced to accept Jesus Christ as their savior, no one will be forced into heaven.

I do not know of any scriptural reference that describes the taking away of our ability to choose. For those who believe they are saved and cannot fall it would mean that they no longer have the ability to choose evil, that would mean that God has taken away our agency. I do not believe in that kind of Christianity.

I understand the concept of choosing Christ Jesus as Savior and following Him forever but I do not accept that we cannot fall away. Judas Iscariot was an apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ yet he fell.

I love the Lord Jesus Christ, I suspect I will always follow Him. I am imperfect, I am a sinner and will need the forgiveness of God and that the grace He offers for those who repent and do their best to follow His son Jesus Christ.