The Southern Baptists have become more influenced by Calvinism as of late. One idea, that isn’t a historical Reformed doctrine (neither is it an historical catholic doctrine for that matter), is called “the Eternal Subordination of the Son” (to the Father). This is something new that the Calvinists have for some reason latched on to, even though I think Calvin would not have agreed with it. This strange doctrine is tied to the belief that women are eternally (even in heaven) subservient to men. So that is where they are going - to a watered-down view of Christ and a Mormon-like view of the sexes.
This is my view of what is going on as an outsider. But it seems like they are going in a harmful direction.
This is not a closed thread, correct. You are correct in your assessment. There is a strong “eternal subordination of the Son” that has entered into Reformed theology in some circles and it is also connected to woman being subordinate to Men even in heaven, which is close to Mormon Trinitarian doctrine. I was wondering when this was going to make it to FR protestant discussion.
Much of the Protestant discussion here centers on soteriology, how God saves and trying to define that. To me the more important issue is the theology on who God is, That is who Christ is (Divine Person with a full Divine and human nature) and that Christ with respect to his Divinity is “not subordinate” to the Father. No early Creedal formula in the early Church (Nicene, Apostles or Athanasian, which most explicity deals with The Trinity and Incarnation of Christ in very dogmatic terms).
Kudos to you to speaking to this and while I am not a Calvinist, you are correct that Calvin nor Luther would agree with this “eternal subordination of the Son” doctrine making its way in much of Reformed circles. Lots of FR Reformed guys cite this guy named Piper, who seems to be among the leaders in Reformed circles in the U.S, quite a bit, so I went to check this guy out and it seems he is a proponent of this heretical doctrine.
I wasn’t raised Baptist but we joined a new Baptist church that is STRONGLY Reformed/Calvinist. Not 5 point Calvinist. Good Biblical exegesis. My husband and I differ from such a completely narrow version of election but we have grown and they put up with us. Now, my pastor is really in to SBC politics and is getting his PhD from Southern Seminary, used to work for Albert Mohler. Last night at small group they mentioned this very topic and the debate is STRONG over this new “idea” and the traditionalists like my pastor who is Reformed does NOT agree with the “new” idea.
I realize more and more that we have to keep guard for what the Bible says because men start to think and then their thinking becomes eminent in their own minds.
Our church is very mission minded and in action. NO altar call but people are pointed to the need for Jesus. I love our church but I see contradictions with having no way but Reformed. Sometimes I bring them up. I think they pity my husband and I because we haven’t read the right theologians. LOL It is mostly ok but sometimes exhausting. I don’t want to read theology even though I recognize the strong importance of sound doctrine. I just don’t believe what men write is any more sound than God’s word.
“...women are eternally (even in heaven) subservient to men...”
Interesting. So they ignore Galatians 3?
“There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slaveg nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.”
FWIW, i read what Tulip stands for. I am certainly no Calvinist.
Subordination is one step away from Arianism.